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Unread 11-10-2014, 01:47 PM   #31
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sergio View Post
I ussualy buy my parts from Mouser electronics, this is their part# link

Digikey is another good place to get electronic parts, here is their part# link.

Make sure You get the 30amp version (your link was for the 20amp)

Yes, the negative side of the relay coil goes to pack negative (the -48v feeding your DC/DC Converter).

Most likely the 12v negative is the same as the 48v negative, there are a few converters on the Market that have isolated outputs, but the most common ones share the same negative.
I'm asking so I can learn something: How does a normally open relay provide power so the head unit can retain memory? I thought that normally closed would provide the circuit for memory when the key is off. If I am wrong, please educate me.
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Unread 11-10-2014, 02:03 PM   #32
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

Cart Sports....what I'm going to do is run the constant +12v feed from the converter to the radio prior to the 48v coil relay, to keep presets, etc. I am going to run a separate +12v feed from the converter, through the 48v coil relay (which is subsequently ran through the key switch), then to the +12v (smaller gauge) power control wire of the radio. To answer your question on the colored wires from the radio...it confused me too. On mine (Pioneer DEH-150MP, nothing special, just basic), there is a very small gauge red wire that requires +12v and a yellow, larger gauge wire that is also +12v. I researched the wiring diagram for this radio and even the diagram states the yellow wire is for "memory". But as Sergio explained, and I have tested....that yellow, larger gauge wire is what I believe is the constant +12v that will keep presets, etc. (and is required to power the radio). I believe the smaller gauge red wire is used to control some other relay or mechanism inside the radio to allow it to be switched on and off (there is no power button on the radio to actually turn it off. All I can do on the front bezel is turn off the main functions (audio basically), when I do this it goes to the clock display and the bezel is still lit up (it's a detachable face stereo, and that's probably part of the design). Today, I am detaching the face everytime I want to shut it off completely, so as not to cause battery drain.
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Unread 11-10-2014, 02:06 PM   #33
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

First, leave it to the manufactures to make things confusing, as I stated in my first post, it has been over 10 years since car radios have worked as they used to.

The Red wire that is normally connected to the accessory position is now just a trigger wire.

The Yellow wire connected to constant power provides all power to the unit.

If you look closely at the installation on just about any radio, there is usually a mention to the fact that the Yellow wire needs to be connected to an adequate power source or directly to the battery.

The idea of the Normally Open relay is so the accessories: lights, horn and Radio trigger wire (red) only get +12v power when the key switch is on the ON position.
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Unread 11-10-2014, 07:53 PM   #34
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

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Originally Posted by Sergio View Post
First, leave it to the manufactures to make things confusing, as I stated in my first post, it has been over 10 years since car radios have worked as they used to.

The Red wire that is normally connected to the accessory position is now just a trigger wire.

The Yellow wire connected to constant power provides all power to the unit.

If you look closely at the installation on just about any radio, there is usually a mention to the fact that the Yellow wire needs to be connected to an adequate power source or directly to the battery.

The idea of the Normally Open relay is so the accessories: lights, horn and Radio trigger wire (red) only get +12v power when the key switch is on the ON position.
Firstly kudos to Sergio for pointing this out as I for one wasn't aware of the recent philosophy regarding recent standby/run wiring with regards to modern radios and I indeed had recently myself connected the radio up with the wire that I incorrectly assumed just gave a trickle to the first battery in my bank.

After reading Sergios post (which i originally doubted until i noticed he included a flyback diode across the relay coil which confirmed to me he knows a bit about electronics) i went out and took some readings and it very much confirms exactly what he describedand is pretty consistant to kraftchicks observations so now i use a 48v relay.

On the 12 volt side of my DC-DC converter feeding my pioneer radio via the yellow wire I have the following,
Code:
radio with red wire / key switch not triggered     1-2mA
radio on standby with keyswitch triggered          160mA
radio on with 3/4 volume                                 550-600mA
additionally in the 48v side I have
Code:
DC-DC powered but unloaded (Quiescent current)          .8-1mA
key switch on with no lights and radio on S/B           42mA
key switch on with no lights and radio running         165mA
key switch on with lights and radio running             560-600mA
3 points for me come out of this thread
-never assume anything, my assumptions were based on old radios.
-give the man a cigar
-sticky his post.

my setup now


The investigation also removed any concerns I had about the passive power use of the dc-dc converter I are using.
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Unread 11-10-2014, 09:43 PM   #35
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

only problem now is the dc-dc convertor is producing .25v of AC at 33.8Khz which is killing my radio reception, that and the 100khz that the light bar produces when its switched on :-(

looks like only bluetooth audio from the phone untill i get some filtering sorted.
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Unread 11-10-2014, 10:17 PM   #36
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

You can try to isolate how the noise is getting to the radio by tunning to a spot with interferience and disconnecting the antenna:

if the noise stops, it is being picked up by the antenna. Try re-routing or improving the antenna.

If the noise is still there, try a 1 microfarad capacitor in parallel with the power.
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Unread 11-10-2014, 10:43 PM   #37
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

the interference is definitely coming up the power as that .25V of AC as it isnt there when i power the radio off the first battery in the bank.
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Unread 11-11-2014, 03:59 AM   #38
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

I have your answer. I can help you do it the correct way . No extra battery or switch. You will use your existing 48-12 volt reducer and when you turn your key switch off you will not lose battery memory! James.
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Unread 11-11-2014, 06:15 AM   #39
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

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Originally Posted by johnnyfootball View Post
I have your answer. I can help you do it the correct way . No extra battery or switch. You will use your existing 48-12 volt reducer and when you turn your key switch off you will not lose battery memory! James.
. . why can't you post your solution here for everyone to learn from?
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Unread 11-11-2014, 07:47 AM   #40
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Default Re: Switched radio, constant memory with reducer

Thanks for the education. It's been 15 years since I've done any stereo stuff and they apparently work a little differently now. Sergio is correct on this one.
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