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Unread 05-14-2019, 09:15 AM   #1
Gone Wild
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Question Charging Lithium batteries?

I have one of those old Powerdrive chargers for my OLD CC DS. It works fine. Today, I will take delivery on a 7 module 48volt lithium pack and I have one question that will probably sound pretty ignorant. I am sure that the answer can be short, IF one has the patience to explain it to me.

If one has a BMS on the lithium pack, won't it control the current coming from the Powerdrive if I wanted to use it to charge the lithium pack until my new charger arrives? Or, would the OBC interfere with the process? I am pretty sure there is a good reason that the old Powerdrive charger will not work with lithium batteries, but I just wanted an explanation. I thought maybe that having a BMS was the reason that the drop in lithium battery packs advertised could get away with using the stock charging system. I am sure there is a very simple reason that I cannot use my powerdrive charger.

Thank you
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Unread 05-15-2019, 07:33 AM   #2
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Default Re: Charging Lithium batteries?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MDLNB View Post
I have one of those old Powerdrive chargers for my OLD CC DS. It works fine. Today, I will take delivery on a 7 module 48volt lithium pack and I have one question that will probably sound pretty ignorant. I am sure that the answer can be short, IF one has the patience to explain it to me.

If one has a BMS on the lithium pack, won't it control the current coming from the Powerdrive if I wanted to use it to charge the lithium pack until my new charger arrives? Or, would the OBC interfere with the process? I am pretty sure there is a good reason that the old Powerdrive charger will not work with lithium batteries, but I just wanted an explanation. I thought maybe that having a BMS was the reason that the drop in lithium battery packs advertised could get away with using the stock charging system. I am sure there is a very simple reason that I cannot use my powerdrive charger.

Thank you
Well I am not educated enough on this whole subject matter to give you an answer. However, I can give you a couple links to other threads that will help you get started with getting answers to this.

Here is a thread: Zeva confusion...., with quite a few members with lots of knowledge in the lithium arena. They discuss a lot of what you are talking about. In Post #9 of that thread, it has a link to another thread with good information as well.

Hopefully the gurus on here will chime in. If not, maybe try sending a PM to a couple of them in those threads.

I'll certainly add advice and help where I can, but this is a bit over my head... Hope this helps. Good luck with your build!
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Unread 05-15-2019, 10:27 AM   #3
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Default Re: Charging Lithium batteries?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBBHC View Post
Well I am not educated enough on this whole subject matter to give you an answer. However, I can give you a couple links to other threads that will help you get started with getting answers to this.

Here is a thread: Zeva confusion...., with quite a few members with lots of knowledge in the lithium arena. They discuss a lot of what you are talking about. In Post #9 of that thread, it has a link to another thread with good information as well.

Hopefully the gurus on here will chime in. If not, maybe try sending a PM to a couple of them in those threads.

I'll certainly add advice and help where I can, but this is a bit over my head... Hope this helps. Good luck with your build!
Thank you. I know there is a big difference between lead acid and lithium batteries, but there is a few similarities such as they both store power. And they both charge. I was just curious as to why my old charger would not work, and why. It helps to better understand how the whole system works.....in layman terms of course.
It is not real important, since I have ordered a new charger that is rated for lithium charging.
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Unread 05-15-2019, 11:22 AM   #4
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Default Re: Charging Lithium batteries?

The simple answer is NO! Do no try to charge your lithium pack with the powerdrive charger and OBC. Lithium batteries are very picky about charging and have to have a very specific type of charge or they WILL be damaged, even if you have a BMS.

A Damaged Lithium Battery pack is a MAJOR FIRE waiting to happen!!! This can not be stressed enough. It WILL burn your house to the ground with it!

Lithium batteries need a LOT more attention, and you MUST have knowledge of the chemistry and how to properly charge the pack or you will be riding around on a ticking time bomb.
The cart in this thread had a BMS that was not configured properly, even though it had the proper charger for lithium batteries, the BMS still allowed the pack to over-discharge while the cart was being driven which caused damaged to one or more of the cells. The damage was not immediately evident, and the battery shorted and burst into flames later on.
48volt club car limthium battery exploded

Read as MUCH as you can about proper care, use, and charging of lithium batteries before you even try to put them in the cart. At the top of each forum there are now sections dedicated to lithium powered carts, and you will be able to find more info in that section.

http://www.buggiesgonewild.com/lithium-club-car/
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Unread 05-15-2019, 02:01 PM   #5
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Default Re: Charging Lithium batteries?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fairtax4me View Post
The simple answer is NO! Do no try to charge your lithium pack with the powerdrive charger and OBC. Lithium batteries are very picky about charging and have to have a very specific type of charge or they WILL be damaged, even if you have a BMS.

A Damaged Lithium Battery pack is a MAJOR FIRE waiting to happen!!! This can not be stressed enough. It WILL burn your house to the ground with it!

Lithium batteries need a LOT more attention, and you MUST have knowledge of the chemistry and how to properly charge the pack or you will be riding around on a ticking time bomb.
The cart in this thread had a BMS that was not configured properly, even though it had the proper charger for lithium batteries, the BMS still allowed the pack to over-discharge while the cart was being driven which caused damaged to one or more of the cells. The damage was not immediately evident, and the battery shorted and burst into flames later on.
48volt club car limthium battery exploded

Read as MUCH as you can about proper care, use, and charging of lithium batteries before you even try to put them in the cart. At the top of each forum there are now sections dedicated to lithium powered carts, and you will be able to find more info in that section.

http://www.buggiesgonewild.com/lithium-club-car/
Thank you. I had been told NOT to use the PowerDrive charger on lithium and had no plans to do so, but I was just curious as to the reason. I have no intention on using it for the lithium.

I took delivery of my seven leaf mods to today. I was impressed as to how well they were packed. Very professional. I put them together and installed the shunts to make it one 48/58volt pack. Right now it reads 53+volts. I am waiting for my BMS and charger to arrive. I am only going to use this lithium pack in my CCDS for a while, because I traded batteries with my wife and hers, being a year older than mine, are very, very weak. Since I did not have to turn in my Trojans as a core trade, I am experimenting with attempting to rejuvenate them using an old Chinese made pulse desulfator. I had a decent maintainer/charger on it but it got hot so I removed it before it might get damaged. I will use this desulfator until the charge goes down where it needs charging and then I will charge it with the Powerdrive charger. Wanted to see if I do it a few times, if it may hold a better charge. Right now, a day after charging the batteries, they are down to 80%. Last time I used the cart with these batteries, on the way home the cart shuttered every time I started from a stop sign. And going up an incline, it shuttered so much I thought I was going to have to get out and push it. But I digress.
Thanks for the warning about the charger. I really had no intention of using it on the lithium. Just wondering if the old chargers had a pulse charge level and that might be the reason for not using it.
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Unread 05-15-2019, 02:21 PM   #6
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Default Re: Charging Lithium batteries?

If you want to learn more about Lithium charging, here is some good information:
https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/..._ion_batteries
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