2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning

indawoods · 12-09-2013, 02:29 PM

Thanks for understanding that I'm new to this site; first post. I inherited a mint 2005 club car electric DS. It has less then 100 miles of use, no joke! It has what I believe is a factory light kit that includes turn signals. The headlights, tail lights (when headlights are on) and turn signals all work perfectly. The brake lights do not. They don't ever work when the brake pedal is pressed. However, they will come on by themselves just out of the blue. I can tell it's the brake light function because the lights are twice as bright as when just the tail lights are on. Sometimes if they come on, if I engage the parking brake, these break lights will go out. When I release the parking brake the break lights come on again! But it's not all the time. I can leave cart alone with no lights on and I can come back later and the brake lights are on, not a good situation.

This cart is equipped with a switch behind the brake pedal that has a brown wire attached to the common terminal and an orange/white wire attached to the "norm closed" terminal. These 2 wires travel under the cart where the brown enters a covered harness, the orange/white is attached to another switch at the "norm closed" terminal and a green wire coming from the harness is attached to the common terminal. Under the seat, there is a small black box mounted to the frame that has 4 wires that lead to the wiring harness mentioned above and a red power wire that attaches to the positive terminal of battery 1(front left under driver's seat). Also, a green/white, a red/white, a blue, and a yellow wire coming from the harness lead to this box. Also coming from this harness are 2 black wires with one plug that plugs into an 8 pronged power receptacle under the drivers seat and attached to the body. If I unplug this double black, all the light functions quit. Until I get this resolved, I leave this unplugged.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!!!!

jakesnake27 · 12-09-2013, 04:32 PM

First off, welcome to BGW!

Does the brake light circuit use one switch or two? I added lights to my cart, and my setup uses two; one mounted to the brake pedal to turn the lights off when the park brake is set, and one under the cart to turn the lights on when the brakes are applied. If you could post some pictures of what you have, that would also help.

indawoods · 12-09-2013, 05:00 PM

Thanks so much for the welcome and for your reply!

There are 2 switches and they appear to be in perfect condition as is everything else because this cart has literally never been on a wet road or grass! I'm attempting to add some pictures and hope they come thru. I included photos of the 2 switches, the black box as described earlier and the double black wires that power the entire light system.

Hope you can help and thanks!!

jakesnake27 · 12-09-2013, 05:29 PM

Great pics...

I would bet that the black box is a voltage reducer. Since your other lights are working, it is probably ok. I am thinking that possibly one (or both) of the switches is malfunctioning. Try to play with the switches by hand and have someone check behind the cart to see if the brake lights are on. They should light when both switches' plungers are out. The switches may simply need to be adjusted. I know when I installed mine I had to play with the positioning a bit before I got it right...

And wow, that cart is pristine!

indawoods · 12-09-2013, 06:19 PM

I think you're spot on with the black box. Tomorrow, I'll definitely try some minor tinkering and adjusting on the switches as you've suggested. I'm not sure I fully understand how the switch on the peddle works. When I step on the main brake peddle does that only activate the under carriage switch and when I press the smaller emergency brake peddle that one activates the peddle switch? If so, I think the upper peddle switch works because when I press that small peddle very gently I can hear a slight but discernible electronic click.

Stay tuned; I really appreciate the help!

jakesnake27 · 12-09-2013, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by indawoods

I think you're spot on with the black box. Tomorrow, I'll definitely try some minor tinkering and adjusting on the switches as you've suggested. I'm not sure I fully understand how the switch on the peddle works. When I step on the main brake peddle does that only activate the under carriage switch and when I press the smaller emergency brake peddle that one activates the peddle switch? If so, I think the upper peddle switch works because when I press that small peddle very gently I can hear a slight but discernible electronic click.

Stay tuned; I really appreciate the help!

The pedal switch gets pushed in when you set the park brake (Little corner pedal pushed in). This opens the circuit and turns the lights off.
When you step on the main brake pedal (park brake not set, so the switch mounted to the brake pedal is out and the circuit is closed), this releases the switch under the cart, which closes the circuit, so the lights light up. Hope that makes sense...

indawoods · 12-10-2013, 06:37 AM

Yes, this makes sense.

The more I work to correct this issue, the more I'm beginning to understand how the wiring works. What I've been referring to as the double black wire that comes from the wiring harness and that attaches to an 8 prong power source on the cart body, I now believe these are the ground wires for the entire lighting system. They are plugged into an 8 prong receptacle attached to the aluminum front body support that is grounded to the frame where the body meets the floor. There are 2 other wires attached to this that must ground other accessories like the horn and perhaps the 12 v reducer since it doesn't seem to be grounded to any negative battery terminal.

While I'm waiting to tinker with the switches, I think I'll start a new thread to help me figure out why my old 2000 DS is dragging its rear end. It isn't the brakes.

jakesnake27 · 12-10-2013, 10:11 AM

Yeah that is your negative ground block, but it should NOT be grounded to the frame, only negative battery terminals. On a gas cart it's ok to ground to frame, on a sparky it can damage the motor, controller, etc. If the ground block has plastic between the terminals and the aluminum, you should be ok.

indawoods · 12-10-2013, 10:36 AM

I'll assume the ground is ok. Both my 2000 & 2005 were factory wired this way. I think the problem is a faulty micro switch under the cart. I tested both with my voltmeter and got 12 volts on the peddle switch. The switch under the cart reads 0 with the peddle pressed. After removing the switch I got 12 volts on just the wires with the peddle pressed. Trying to find one locally.

indawoods · 12-11-2013, 04:37 PM

Heres an update on my suddenly difficult simple project. First and foremost, the brake lights still don't work. All the other lights work and also appear to be on a different circuit that operates even when the key is off and in tow mode. The brake light circuit does not show voltage in tow mode.

I found a replacement switch for the bottom switch that was truly defective but it was different then mine and it got me to thinking (a bad habit of mine). It has 3 terminals where my switches only have 2. The third terminal in the middle is titled "normally open". My present switches have "common" and "normally closed".

Before I expend more effort I'd like to report that I repositioned the original bottom switch and it is "clicking" perfectly where it definitely wasn't before. Also, before I go and replace both switches heres what my volt meter readings presently say. I get 0 volts on the peddle switch when no peddles are pressed. I get 12 volts on the peddle switch when I press either the brake by itself or the brake and emergency brake together.

On the under carriage switch I get 12 volts without pressing any peddles and 0 volts when I press the brake peddle or brake peddle and emergency brake together. This doesn't seem right and it seems backwards! It would seem that I should be getting 0 volts when I press nothing or when the emergency brake is engaged and I should be getting 12 volts when I press just the brake peddle. If it's reading 12 volts with no peddles pressed it would also seem I'm draining the batteries for no good reason?

Another thought I have would be should I try a new 3 terminal switch using the "normally open" terminal for the lower switch to reverse the backwards open/closed settings that I seem to have now on the bottom switch?

I do believe I may have some funky wiring even though I'm quite sure it was done at the factory. However, it may have been done at the dealer when it was new. How can I tell?

Thanks for all your patience and hopefully something good will come from this!

12-09-2013, 02:29 PM	#1
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18	2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning Thanks for understanding that I'm new to this site; first post. I inherited a mint 2005 club car electric DS. It has less then 100 miles of use, no joke! It has what I believe is a factory light kit that includes turn signals. The headlights, tail lights (when headlights are on) and turn signals all work perfectly. The brake lights do not. They don't ever work when the brake pedal is pressed. However, they will come on by themselves just out of the blue. I can tell it's the brake light function because the lights are twice as bright as when just the tail lights are on. Sometimes if they come on, if I engage the parking brake, these break lights will go out. When I release the parking brake the break lights come on again! But it's not all the time. I can leave cart alone with no lights on and I can come back later and the brake lights are on, not a good situation. This cart is equipped with a switch behind the brake pedal that has a brown wire attached to the common terminal and an orange/white wire attached to the "norm closed" terminal. These 2 wires travel under the cart where the brown enters a covered harness, the orange/white is attached to another switch at the "norm closed" terminal and a green wire coming from the harness is attached to the common terminal. Under the seat, there is a small black box mounted to the frame that has 4 wires that lead to the wiring harness mentioned above and a red power wire that attaches to the positive terminal of battery 1(front left under driver's seat). Also, a green/white, a red/white, a blue, and a yellow wire coming from the harness lead to this box. Also coming from this harness are 2 black wires with one plug that plugs into an 8 pronged power receptacle under the drivers seat and attached to the body. If I unplug this double black, all the light functions quit. Until I get this resolved, I leave this unplugged. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!!!!
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18

12-09-2013, 04:32 PM	#2
jakesnake27 Gone Wild Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 14,245	Re: 2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning First off, welcome to BGW! Does the brake light circuit use one switch or two? I added lights to my cart, and my setup uses two; one mounted to the brake pedal to turn the lights off when the park brake is set, and one under the cart to turn the lights on when the brakes are applied. If you could post some pictures of what you have, that would also help.
jakesnake27 Gone Wild Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 14,245

12-09-2013, 05:29 PM	#4
jakesnake27 Gone Wild Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 14,245	Re: 2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning Great pics... I would bet that the black box is a voltage reducer. Since your other lights are working, it is probably ok. I am thinking that possibly one (or both) of the switches is malfunctioning. Try to play with the switches by hand and have someone check behind the cart to see if the brake lights are on. They should light when both switches' plungers are out. The switches may simply need to be adjusted. I know when I installed mine I had to play with the positioning a bit before I got it right... And wow, that cart is pristine!
jakesnake27 Gone Wild Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 14,245

12-09-2013, 06:19 PM	#5
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18	Re: 2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning I think you're spot on with the black box. Tomorrow, I'll definitely try some minor tinkering and adjusting on the switches as you've suggested. I'm not sure I fully understand how the switch on the peddle works. When I step on the main brake peddle does that only activate the under carriage switch and when I press the smaller emergency brake peddle that one activates the peddle switch? If so, I think the upper peddle switch works because when I press that small peddle very gently I can hear a slight but discernible electronic click. Stay tuned; I really appreciate the help!
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18

12-10-2013, 06:37 AM	#7
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18	Re: 2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning Yes, this makes sense. The more I work to correct this issue, the more I'm beginning to understand how the wiring works. What I've been referring to as the double black wire that comes from the wiring harness and that attaches to an 8 prong power source on the cart body, I now believe these are the ground wires for the entire lighting system. They are plugged into an 8 prong receptacle attached to the aluminum front body support that is grounded to the frame where the body meets the floor. There are 2 other wires attached to this that must ground other accessories like the horn and perhaps the 12 v reducer since it doesn't seem to be grounded to any negative battery terminal. While I'm waiting to tinker with the switches, I think I'll start a new thread to help me figure out why my old 2000 DS is dragging its rear end. It isn't the brakes.
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18

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12-10-2013, 10:11 AM	#8
jakesnake27 Gone Wild Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 14,245	Re: 2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning Yeah that is your negative ground block, but it should NOT be grounded to the frame, only negative battery terminals. On a gas cart it's ok to ground to frame, on a sparky it can damage the motor, controller, etc. If the ground block has plastic between the terminals and the aluminum, you should be ok.
jakesnake27 Gone Wild Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 14,245

12-10-2013, 10:36 AM	#9
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18	Re: 2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning I'll assume the ground is ok. Both my 2000 & 2005 were factory wired this way. I think the problem is a faulty micro switch under the cart. I tested both with my voltmeter and got 12 volts on the peddle switch. The switch under the cart reads 0 with the peddle pressed. After removing the switch I got 12 volts on just the wires with the peddle pressed. Trying to find one locally.
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18

12-11-2013, 04:37 PM	#10
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18	Re: 2005 Club Car DS IQ brake lights malfunctioning Heres an update on my suddenly difficult simple project. First and foremost, the brake lights still don't work. All the other lights work and also appear to be on a different circuit that operates even when the key is off and in tow mode. The brake light circuit does not show voltage in tow mode. I found a replacement switch for the bottom switch that was truly defective but it was different then mine and it got me to thinking (a bad habit of mine). It has 3 terminals where my switches only have 2. The third terminal in the middle is titled "normally open". My present switches have "common" and "normally closed". Before I expend more effort I'd like to report that I repositioned the original bottom switch and it is "clicking" perfectly where it definitely wasn't before. Also, before I go and replace both switches heres what my volt meter readings presently say. I get 0 volts on the peddle switch when no peddles are pressed. I get 12 volts on the peddle switch when I press either the brake by itself or the brake and emergency brake together. On the under carriage switch I get 12 volts without pressing any peddles and 0 volts when I press the brake peddle or brake peddle and emergency brake together. This doesn't seem right and it seems backwards! It would seem that I should be getting 0 volts when I press nothing or when the emergency brake is engaged and I should be getting 12 volts when I press just the brake peddle. If it's reading 12 volts with no peddles pressed it would also seem I'm draining the batteries for no good reason? Another thought I have would be should I try a new 3 terminal switch using the "normally open" terminal for the lower switch to reverse the backwards open/closed settings that I seem to have now on the bottom switch? I do believe I may have some funky wiring even though I'm quite sure it was done at the factory. However, it may have been done at the dealer when it was new. How can I tell? Thanks for all your patience and hopefully something good will come from this!
indawoods Not Yet Wild Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 18

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