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-   -   PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor (http://www.buggiesgonewild.com/electric-club-car/92120-pq-bandit-vs-d-d-81-14-vs-electric-motor.html)

InVision 04-02-2014 12:58 PM

PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
This has been a learning process on series carts.

Since I need to increase my wife's 2003 Club Car DS to ~ 25mph I am weighing all my options. The PQ says that the Bandit could increase to 25 mph on their website with stock controller. When I talked to them they said probably 20ish. My question is the money wasted on the motor only or can I later get one of Scotty's performance packages and use the Bandit motor? I am torn because if it works out ok with just motor she will be in good shape. But if I have to add speed package and a different motor than the Bandit may be wasted monies...

PUNT !!

M

joesam 04-02-2014 01:12 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
A *Series Bandit* can't get you to 25 mph no matter the controller. An upgraded controller does not create speed *in a standard/Bandit motor* - just more torque for climbing hills etc.

BUT you do need an upgraded controller to handle the higher amperage demands of a specially wound/high performance (non-standard) Series motor.

Punt back!

InVision 04-02-2014 01:47 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
So what get's you 25 mph? Should I be looking at different motors? What motors should I be looking into?


M

branson 04-02-2014 02:14 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
48 volts with a speed motor should do it

InVision 04-02-2014 02:15 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Argg... What are the speed motors?

M

gsf35099 04-02-2014 02:22 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
I'm pretty sure if you talk with PQ again and tell them you want the speed they can customer the motor for that. Pretty sure you lose the torque though.

branson 04-02-2014 02:23 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
well I sure made that sound easy. in order to go 48 you're going to need to upgrade a few things. a battery charger, controller solenoid, forward reverse switch, all the cables, and a few other odds and ends along the way.

branson 04-02-2014 02:25 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by InVision (Post 1008619)
Argg... What are the speed motors?

M

when motors are built they are built for a certain job. you can build them for maximum torque. you can build them for maximum speed. or you can build in for anything in the middle. it had to do with how many winding and where they put them inside the pieces of the motor. hey call to plumb quick should clear it up for you

Olman 04-02-2014 02:30 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by InVision (Post 1008612)
So what get's you 25 mph? Should I be looking at different motors? What motors should I be looking into?


M

My motor from EMP got my stock (I did have 2ga cables) 36 volt series cart to 24 mph with a nice increase in torque. I was happy until---I was cruising at the campground with 4 people on board and the controller went into thermal shutdown. Bigger motor, slow cruising, and heavy load was too much for it. What Joesam is telling you is very true. A bandit should work fine with stock controller and provide a good speed increase. If you want 25 mph steady and not take a year to get there, you will need a bigger motor probably than the bandit but like me, then sooner or later you will have to upgrade to a bigger controller.

joesam 04-02-2014 02:57 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
You may have noticed we're kinda avoiding telling you who to buy from, and its big dollar item(s). We're not trying to be mysterious, just cautious. At the end of the day, choice of vendor is up to you, but we do try to support the sponsors. Your cart is already 48v right? You don't need a charger - but you will need a "kit" consisting of:

1) Speed Motor (PQ is named Assassin and possibly they have others, D&D have them too)

2) At least 400 amp controller (to handle the "beast of a motor")

3) HD F/R switch or solenoid type F/R switch (talk to Scotty re: the solenoid version)

4) 2 ga. cables (you've already ordered them)

Feeling better?

mymonstertruck 04-03-2014 09:07 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
I would recommend PQ motor, F&R switch and upgrade the cables at the same time. The cables will help with the temp and torque. After that save up for a controller.

InVision 04-03-2014 09:14 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
I really like the PQ folks, all seem helpful and nice. I got a email from them and they suggested - "You need the Rattlesnake II $700.00, new motor no core exchange needed, 700 amp controller $575.00, HD solenoid $160.00, HD F&R switch $160.00, 4ga. wire set $240.00………with this set up you’ll be around 30 mph with good torque."


Also D&D (Vic) said that with the 81-41 motor and a 500 amp Altrax (sp?)controller I would be in the high 20's. It was $525 for that motor.

sunoco 04-03-2014 09:30 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Get the motor from your motor place of choice.

Get the cables, controller, solenoid and F/R from www.cartsunlimited.net

InVision 04-03-2014 09:37 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
I did get my cables from Scotty. Haven't really got a plan together yet.

M

89GatorClub 04-03-2014 10:11 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by InVision (Post 1009001)
I really like the PQ folks, all seem helpful and nice. I got a email from them and they suggested - "You need the Rattlesnake II $700.00, new motor no core exchange needed, 700 amp controller $575.00, HD solenoid $160.00, HD F&R switch $160.00, 4ga. wire set $240.00………with this set up you’ll be around 30 mph with good torque."


Also D&D (Vic) said that with the 81-41 motor and a 500 amp Altrax (sp?)controller I would be in the high 20's. It was $525 for that motor.

Its ok, I am getting mixed and confused email. They want me to send in my 36v motor and upgrade it.. I have already upgraded everything to 48volts and was asking the same question as you are... Looking to get about 25 MPH without losing a lot of torque on the bottom end.

InVision 04-03-2014 10:29 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
I am now thinking of one of Scotty's Speed Controller packages, but now I am really confused on which motor to buy.

M

joesam 04-03-2014 11:49 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Invision - sent you a PM yesterday - just a FYI thing. Not sure if you saw it.

scooterman 04-03-2014 01:00 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by InVision (Post 1009071)
I am now thinking of one of Scotty's Speed Controller packages, but now I am really confused on which motor to buy.

M

Motors are the difficult choice, it can be a big thing, so research thoroughly. JMO.

InVision 04-03-2014 01:02 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
yep trying to research it. Found D&D and PQ. Got a line on a blue thunder but can't find any data.

M

89GatorClub 04-03-2014 01:18 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
I would like to see what you find out. Now that my gasser is rebuilt I want to up the motor on sparkie

scooterman 04-03-2014 01:48 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
GE makes a really good motor also, probably one of the factory best. JMO

Revolution 04-03-2014 08:37 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
I went with PQ rattlesnake 2. D&D did not really want much to do with 72 volts. I don't know what the rattlesnake will do on 48volts, but on 72volts with 20 inch tires I can do 40 mph, i don't ever really go that fast but it can do it. I run 30 most of the time with 50% throttle.

Edit to add: 450 amp alltrax controller. max amps I have ever seen on this setup was less than 300 depending on which meter I trust. One said 260 another was 285 the other was 290 something.

Speedchaser 04-03-2014 09:29 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by scooterman (Post 1009171)
GE makes a really good motor also, probably one of the factory best. JMO

Pretty sure ge is out of golf cart motors and advance motors would be the mirror replacement. I believe they have a motor that can get you to 25with just motor upgrade. we ran the ge motor at 25 on series cart and no other upgrades.

Club Car AMD 7119 4.0/5.5 Non-Peak HP @ 4150/5700 RPM 36-48 Volt, 25 MPH, (Higher Speed) DC Electric Motor

InVision 04-03-2014 09:33 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
AMD 7119 Replacement for D380 (D-380) Golf Car Motor for Club Car & Older Yamahas. D-380 The "Eye-opener" This is an eye-opener! Speeds up to 25 MPH! This is a replacement for General Electric motor which is rated at 4 HP @ 4150 RPM for a 36 volt system and 5.5 HP @ 5700 RPM for 48 volt system.

The motor mounts via a 10 tooth female spline coupler used with the Graziano and Kawasaki axles. These axles were used in Club Car and older Yamahas.

This is a series wound motor for use with a series or fleet system only. Not for use with Power Drive Plus (Regen I or II versions), IQ, or any other Club Car golf cart or utility vehicle with a separately excited motor and regenerative braking.

Use with 400+ amp controller NEW CONTROLLER

Speedchaser 04-03-2014 09:43 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
If you have regen or sepex system this motor won't work.
Advance also makes a sepex that gets 25, its what I am running, however I upgraded my controller and never tested it with stock controller.

Speedchaser 04-03-2014 09:45 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
AMD 48-volt, 7-hp@5106 rpm speed and torque motor. This motor requires controller #GCT10620 for DS, Precedent all years, #GCT107107 or #GCT107108 for 2000-08, 2010-11 DS, Precedent. For maximum performance, safety and durability 4 gauge cables (#1260) throughout the car and heavy-duty solenoid are required. For Club Car IQ 2000-up DS, Precedent

scooterman 04-03-2014 10:05 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Speedchaser (Post 1009431)
AMD 48-volt, 7-hp@5106 rpm speed and torque motor. This motor requires controller #GCT10620 for DS, Precedent all years, #GCT107107 or #GCT107108 for 2000-08, 2010-11 DS, Precedent. For maximum performance, safety and durability 4 gauge cables (#1260) throughout the car and heavy-duty solenoid are required. For Club Car IQ 2000-up DS, Precedent

How fast is the speed and torque motor?

Speedchaser 04-03-2014 10:17 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
25 on flat paved ,this motor has good torque though but slows on grass surface probably to 20

sunoco 04-04-2014 12:36 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by scooterman (Post 1009171)
GE makes a really good motor also, probably one of the factory best. JMO

Love me a D380. I buy them whenever I see them.

Built a cart for my uncle running a D380 and Alltrax SPM 400A and see 24-26 mph with awesome torque.

sunoco 04-04-2014 12:37 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Speedchaser (Post 1009431)
AMD 48-volt, 7-hp@5106 rpm speed and torque motor. This motor requires controller #GCT10620 for DS, Precedent all years, #GCT107107 or #GCT107108 for 2000-08, 2010-11 DS, Precedent. For maximum performance, safety and durability 4 gauge cables (#1260) throughout the car and heavy-duty solenoid are required. For Club Car IQ 2000-up DS, Precedent

He has a series cart. This motor reccomendation will not work

InVision 04-04-2014 08:57 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Spent sometime calculating on what motor I need.

Specs - min 4800 RPM series motor that works with standard controller. Called PQ and the Bandit is only 4000 RPM. It certainly looks like there NO motors available. Now looking at AMD motors also. I guess I am out of luck... Need motor, controller, F-R switch.

M

Great white north 04-04-2014 09:09 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Yep , one of the advantages you have by not going series cart or motor, if you want speed - you go PDS sexpex system :thumbup:

joesam 04-04-2014 10:03 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Agreed - Any series motor with that speed/capacity requires new controller and F/R.

sunoco 04-04-2014 10:38 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
and cables and solenoid

joesam 04-04-2014 11:58 AM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Ya know - nobody mentioned this yet but I was thinking, since invision has already purchased 2 ga. cables (added torque), and is thinking about Bandit (10% more torque) AND he lives on flat ground (FLA) - what about getting the last 8 mph THIS WAY?

Just a thought, 'cause its not a hunting cart (mud & hills) - its more of a neighborhood cruiser. He will need access to an Arbor press....but hey, his motor will be off anyway (while installing Bandit) so he can just pull the old gears and do this.

greg-g 04-04-2014 12:53 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
Well There is your second gold star for the DAY **


Quote:

Originally Posted by joesam (Post 1009660)
Ya know - nobody mentioned this yet but I was thinking, since invision has already purchased 2 ga. cables (added torque), and is thinking about Bandit (10% more torque) AND he lives on flat ground (FLA) - what about getting the last 8 mph THIS WAY?

Just a thought, 'cause its not a hunting cart (mud & hills) - its more of a neighborhood cruiser. He will need access to an Arbor press....but hey, his motor will be off anyway (while installing Bandit) so he can just pull the old gears and do this.


joesam 04-04-2014 01:19 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
I know eh? Stock controller and standard F/R s/b fine with that setup.

Speedchaser 04-04-2014 06:09 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
My friend ran that series Advance motor I mentioned earlier and no other upgrades with no problems. His was a year 2000 DS though.

I ran the same motor on a 2000 DS cart but I had upgraded the controller to 400 amp. Mine ran a little smoother with more torque but his was just as fast if not a little faster than mine. They ran at 25 MPH.

sunoco 04-04-2014 06:25 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
You two need a moment alone?

I don't think the torque loss would be ideal or desired. That's why most people don't just change gears. I don't know that the bandit would compensate

joesam 04-04-2014 06:38 PM

Re: PQ Bandit .vs. D&D 81-14 .vs. ?? electric motor
 
With 2 ga. cables AND a Bandit, I'm thinking the torque loss would be nominal (if detectable at all). The 6:1 gears are brutal on torque, but I think the 8:1 are very do-able in that configuration (Of course, I've been wrong before, but that was back in '62 - since then - pretty darn solid!

I'm not familiar with the Advance motor, so maybe that's the ticket??


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