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Old 02-26-2015, 09:08 PM   #1
bdl0485
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Default What to do first?

Last fall i bought a 2002 ezgo pds, completely stock. This is my first cart, and it will mainly be used for the neighborhood. It currently has the freedom chip which will get me 18-19 on flat, but will drop down to 12-13 uphill. I just ordered 23" tires with jakes 6" lift. I want to get 500 amp controller, motor, forward-reverse switch, 2 gauge battery wires, and 48 v system. The batteries are only a year old so i will not be doing the conversion yet.

So my question is what do i need to do now, and what can wait? I was hoping i can get away with doing the controller and the f&r switch. But would that be too much for the stock battery wire?

My main goal is to go up my neighborhood hills (which are not that steep) without the cart slowing way down.

Am i missing anything else i should be looking into? Also, when i do the jakes lift kit, is there anything else i should change while I'm under there?
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Old 02-26-2015, 11:22 PM   #2
Nate
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Default Re: What to do first?

Let heat make your decisions. Is anything warm to the touch after a run up a hill? If so, change that component first. If everything feels cool then do the higher amp controller first. The extra amps should show you the next weakest component.

Make sure you have good brakes while you're under there.
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Old 02-27-2015, 09:22 AM   #3
mattadata
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Default Re: What to do first?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdl0485 View Post
"I was hoping i can get away with doing the controller and the f&r switch."
Do PDS carts need an upgraded F&R switch? I thought only the carts with the F&R switch near the seat needed to be upgraded.
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Old 02-27-2015, 09:28 AM   #4
cgtech
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Default Re: What to do first?

F&r upgrade is not possible with pds (f&r switching done inside controller). Those 6ga cables are not gonna fly @ 500a, wouldnt be happy @ 400a. Stock motor is happiest @ 400a, stock motor wont love 48v & big tires combo either. Stock solenoid is garbage with stock amps & volts. So, i say first get 500a controller (dialed back to 400 for now), with new solenoid & new cables. This speed & torque increase will get you motivated on the rest.
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Old 02-27-2015, 09:52 AM   #5
JohnnieB
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Default Re: What to do first?

Mathematically, the 23" tires will increase you cart's Speed by ~28% and reduce your Torque by ~22%, so it will be faster on level ground and slow down more on hills.

All carts slow down going uphill, it is unavoidable. However, there are things that can be done to reduce the relative speed loss on hills, but taller than stock tires being a step in the opposite direction of your stated goal, so installing 23" tires is something else that has to be compensated for in addition to the original physics that caused the cart to slow as much as it did going up an incline.

You mentioned changing the F/R switch. No need to, since the F/R switch in a PDS has zero effect on performance. (Changing the direction of current flow through the field windings to reverse the direction the motor shaft rotates is done by the controller, the rocker switch next to the key just tells the controller what to do.)

Your end set-up you've described is roughly the same as mine. Different tire height, so the motor requirements might be different and the pack voltage is different. I run a 42V pack since that voltage takes my motor to its max recommended RPM, and beyond, but with 23" tires, that probably won't be an issue since you probably won't have enough high end torque to spin the motor at max RPM.

If your high current cables are OEM, they may be a mix of 4Ga and 6Ga and they are 13 years old, so they are the first upgrade to make.
You may decided to use six 8V batteries to get 48V and both terminals of 8V batteries are on the same side, so longer interconnecting cables are needed, so be sure to stipulate 8V batteries when you order your cables. Cables for 8V batteries work on 6V batteries, but not the other way. Also, replace all 10 high current cables. (The stock 10Ga F1 and F2 cables are sufficient, they only carry about 30A max.)

Next would be the controller/solenoid pair. You are planning to run 36V for the time being and up it to 48V when you replace batteries. Get a 48V 400A super-duty solenoid no matter what ampacity controller you decided to get. lesser ampacity solenoids have to match the pack voltage, but the super-duty works at 36V, 42V and 48V, so you don't have to replace it when you up the pack voltage.

You can install a 500A controller while still running a stock PDS, but a stock PDS motor can only tolerate about 400A, so you need to turn down the controller's max amps until you get a motor that can handle 500A.

If you plan on using regen braking, pick a motor designed to withstand the heat load it generates. Call D&D and tell them what you have and what you want it to do and they'll come up with a recommendation.

FWIW: Your cart slows by about 32% on the hills you are running it on. This percentage is a bit misleading since the PDS controller limits the motor to 4400 RPM (about 18-19 MPH with 18" tires) by reducing the power going to the motor, so the true top speed is not reached. Without the RPM limiting, the cart will reach about 24MPH on 18" tire at 36V, so the true speed loss is about 46%.

My cart's tires are only 17" tall, so I have a ~6% torque gain over stock in addition to a high-speed/high-torque motor and my speed loss is about 25% on inclines that may be steeper than the hills you have.

On a brighter note, sepex motors don't slow as much on hills as series motors.
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Old 02-27-2015, 04:05 PM   #6
sportcoupe
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Default Re: What to do first?

ScottyB can get you best deal on controller, solenoid and battery cables.
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Old 02-27-2015, 04:58 PM   #7
stang99x
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Default Re: What to do first?

I've got a set of new cables lying around for that model, actually I have two sets...one in 2 gauge and 1 in 4 gauge if you are interested. They are silver soldered connection style.
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Old 02-27-2015, 05:38 PM   #8
bdl0485
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Default Re: What to do first?

Thanks guys for all the good info. Just to make sure i am on the right track i need
-pkg 909 from scottyb
- go ahead and get new 2 gauge, but go ahead and get the 8v set so it will work once i do the conversion. (stang99x what are you asking? and they are for the 8v batteries?
-once i get the contoller, i need to dial it back to 400, until i convert to 48 v and get the new motor.
-new brakes for the bigger tires

I know the bigger tires I'm putting on the cart is going to kill my uphill speed, I'm just trying to get some of it back and not drop to much. I would be happy with the top speed of lower to mid 20's, with more torque so it will not drop to much on hills. So when i get the motor I'm hoping to find something that is built for torque, more then speed.

Also, do you guys think i should go ahead and get new hd rear springs, and new bushing for the front end and rear end. How often do the wheel bearing go out on these things, would it be worth replacing now if not bad, or just repack them?
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Old 02-27-2015, 05:57 PM   #9
stang99x
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Default Re: What to do first?

On the brakes, unless you plan on adding an aftermarket disc set, just make sure yours are in good shape (make sure the shoes are in good shape, and that the cables aren't rusted or broken through) I lift carts all day long, and I've never added an aftermarket brake setup.
HD springs are another one of the useless addons, unless you are carrying two "very large" people on the back seat or a very large amount of weight (like over 400 pounds) New bushings are always a good idea, most times they are all cracked, split and buldging out. The front wheel bearings are pretty solid, just take yours off and clean and regrease them. If you see a problem (missing balls, metal shavings, obvious signs of failure) then replace them. The rear axle bearings are a more common issue on these. They will all fail at some point, some sooner than others. It's a pretty cheap fix if you do it yourself. Get a new bearing, seal and clip for each side and do it yourself, under $50. (I get the new clips as it's a crappy feeling when one flies off into the void of space and you don't have another on hand)

I have an old series cart, and I know the feeling for how slow uphill can be. I got tired of mine fast, and upgraded to an Alltrax AXE 500amp and an AMD 7126 Raptor speed motor. But I have also done several torque setups with D&D ES52 type motors, and they will pull a car no problem. I'll check the cables and measure to confirm they are the right size. I'll make you a good deal on them. They are Excelene Welding cable with tinned copper lugs. Shoot me an email at Stang99x@yahoo.com. I'll try and help you pick the best options for what you want from an installer's view.
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