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Old 02-20-2017, 07:30 PM   #1
Conradconrad
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Default Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

First off, thanks to the forum, I can say how much it has already helped me just reading these thread and posts.


2007 TXT 36v PDS with dash F/R switch.

It has the Alltrax dcx500PDS w adpt, ITS

Solenoid is white-rogers 70-120224-5F
(not sure if that is a restrictor plate for the mph I should be having)

Brute force batteries ~2 years old- will be testing power either tonight or tomorrow

Wheels are changed but the tires are 205/50-10 (checked inflation), no lift.

Back seat with the additional utility bed fold down.

Also ordered a led digital volt meter from ScottyB.

I hit 18.9mph-19.1/2 using a Garmin GPS. Up hill I slow down to 15.1mph-15.8mph I live in south florida- flat everywhere minus intercoastal waterway bridges are the only hills, with myself ~185lbs and my wife(I will be murdered if I mention her weight)

Acceleration seems very linear.
I purchased from a family who is not mechanical at all. They kept saying the motor was upgraded but when the mother lifted the seat she pointed at the controller. They had a golf shop do "some work" after they had a issue which lead the to the alltrax controller upgrade a few years ago.

1) Question, could the alltrax be "turned down or not turned on" to a 19mph level and be holding back? I dont have the cables, a windows pc nor a wall wart to plug in and download software. Although I could borrow a windows 7 laptop.

2)Could the solenoid be holding back as I cant figure out if it is a stock solenoid or should be a Heavy Duty one?

Looks like I will probably need to change cable soon anyways as they are a 4 gauge/6 gauge combination and you all mentioned minimum 4 gauge throughout the cart.

3) Where else could there be issues? New to this level of electric motor diagnostics and looking for direction?

4)Last question, previously mentioned in other thread ezgo 36v pds 24mph on flat with 18inch wheels, charge battery pack and the alltrax- is that alltrax set at 400 or 500a?

Goal is to get the full potential out of the motor at the 400a(which was reported that is better for longevity on the ezgo motor) ie more than 18.9-19.1mph

Sorry if this seems like a lot of questions
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Old 02-21-2017, 11:25 AM   #2
Conradconrad
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

From searching the forum it seems as though the white rogers solenoid 70-120224-SF is a factory solenoid. If the controller was installed by a golf cart shop they "may" have made the some of the parameters of the dcx500 more limiting to work with the rest of the stock cart. I think the previous people had a speed chip and ran it like that and had a battery of electrical problem that fried something and they had it serviced and a new controller was recommended.
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Old 02-21-2017, 11:29 AM   #3
JohnnieB
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

You have stock height tires (~18" tall) and most likely stock gears (12.44:1) in the differential, so you ought to be getting upwards of 24 MPH with properly installed DCX controller and a 36V battery pack in reasonably good health while carrying less than 400 pounds.

The ~ 24 MPH expectation is based on widespread results reported by many forum members replacing the stock controller with DCX and XCT controllers in their PDS cart as well personal experience.

In freedom mode, the stock PDS controller limits the motor to about 4400 RPM, which is about 18-19 MPH, however the stock PDS motor will spin faster than that when powered from a 36V battery pack. The DCX con6troller does not use the speed sensor, so it does not impose an RPM limit on the motor and the RPM limit in a XCT controller (if RPM limiting is user selected) can be user adjusted up to 8000RPM, but the Max recommended RPM for most motors is typically in the 6000 RPM to 6500 RPM range.

When installed in an otherwise stock PDS cart traveling on level pavement, a good 36V battery pack will accelerate a stock PDS motor to about 5600 RPM, which is roughly 24 MPH.

There are a myriad of reasons why your cart is in the neighborhood of 5 MPH slower than that.

Tires and tire inflation. Stock tires (Carlisle Links) have a Max recommended inflation pressure of 22 PSI. Lower pressure tires, under-inflated tires and some tread patterns have higher rolling resistance than stock tires.

Voltage applied to Armature. Higher the voltage applied, the higher the RPM achievable for same amount of drag (load).
Battery voltage drops under load. For a 36V pack the batteries in and of themselves drop about 1V per 100A of current draw. If the batteries are in poor health, the drop more.

All amp delivery systems (Cables, connections and contacts) have resistance and drop some voltage when amps are passing. If there is excessive resistance, the drop is excessive. In your case, you have a miox of 6Ga and 4Ga cables. You also have a solenoid with a 50A continuous rating. (Here's the specs -- Solenoid, SPNO, 36 VDC Isolated Coil, Continuous Duty, Normally Open Continuous Contact Rating 50 Amps, Inrush 200 Amps, Normally Closed Continous Contact Rating 30 Amps, Inrush 30 Amps)

Then there are controller settings, possible ITS issues and is the correct field map being used.

To answer your Questions:
1. Yes, the max speed cam be turned down in a DCX controller. Since the previous owners were a family with kids, the DCX may have been adjusted to emulate the performance of a stock PDS cart. Need to see what the controller settings are.

2. The white-rogers 70-120224-5F too wimpy for a stock PDS controller and wholly inadequate for a DCX controller of any amp size.

3. Mentioned above.

4. In general terms Amps = Torque and Volts = Speed. At top speed on level pavement, your cart's motor draws less than 100A, so any amp setting of 100A or above will take it to top speed.

No matter what the main reason causing your cart to only do about 19 MPH, it needs all 10 high current cables to be 4Ga or thicker and a 200A or larger solenoid.

I suspect the DCX was detuned to meet the previous owner's needs/desires.
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Old 02-21-2017, 11:51 AM   #4
Conradconrad
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

Thanks for the reply.
Last night I checked wires throughout the cart. All are 4gauge minus two connecting three batteries. I have replacements coming for that.

Can you recommend a solenoid that would be a good replacement. Based on your previous post I think if I get to programming the dcx I would like to run about 400a for stock motor life longevity. And maybe something that would work with a PQ bandit if I ever went down that path.

In the mean time I'll work on getting my hands on a windows 7 laptop and a USB to serial cable. From what I read since the controller will be in the cart, I have to put the rear on jack stands and keep my foot on the accelerator while in the controller pro software?

The batteries I charged fully and let sit 12 hrs then measured with a craftsman multimeter
After 12 hrs
6.40
6.46
6.42
6.36
6.40
6.40
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Old 02-21-2017, 12:37 PM   #5
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

The battery voltages look okay.

After the additional 4Ga are installed, check the voltage drop under load while accelerating from stand still and at top speed.

As for the solenoid: http://www.cartsunlimited.net/solenoids.html

You have to press pedal or jumper B+ to the solenoid coil in a series cart to power up the controller, but not so in SepEx carts. Run/Tow in Run, Key ON and either F or R selected on F/R switch is all it takes to power up the controller in a PDS cart.

It is next to impossible, or at least difficult, to get a stock PDS motor to draw much over 400A for a significant length of time with 18" tall tires. The people that are prone to burning out stock PDS motors when controllers set to 500A or more, are the ones running 22" and taller tires, especially the low pressure type and living in hilly areas. But it is a good idea to turn down the max amps on DCX500 to about 80% when it is feeding a stock PDS motor.
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Old 02-21-2017, 01:37 PM   #6
Conradconrad
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

Thank you JohnnieB!!!!! Would you recommend I move the batteries around in order as I will be disconnecting them anyways. I was thinking of moving the two that have the highest charge to be connected to accessory(lights). You mentioned battery voltage looks ok, minus the one battery that is 6.36 after 12+hr period post full charge, I thought 100% was about 6.37v? I think the batteries are ok as I did a solo 6.3 mile wind(~10mph) nonstop(minus 6 traffic lights where I sat all of 15 seconds) includes 4 climbs up hills per say. Came back tested voltage immediately.
6.26, 6.28, 6.28, 6.29, 6.32, 6.35
What do you think? I did notice later that longer it sat the voltage slowly increased.
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Old 02-21-2017, 02:33 PM   #7
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

Batteries are fine. If you have accessories connected to two batteries for 12 volts, I'd recommend buying a voltage reducer. That will drain ALL six batteries the same amount.

In the short term, I wouldn't worry about moving them around, unless you don't plan on a reducer. Then I'd rotate batteries every couple of months. Depends on the load. Lights can be 2x55 watts, or LEDs, which are WAY more efficient. Stereos can be low to high drain, depending on what you have.
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Old 02-21-2017, 04:05 PM   #8
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

Quote:
Originally Posted by yurtle View Post
Batteries are fine. If you have accessories connected to two batteries for 12 volts, I'd recommend buying a voltage reducer. That will drain ALL six batteries the same amount.

In the short term, I wouldn't worry about moving them around, unless you don't plan on a reducer. Then I'd rotate batteries every couple of months. Depends on the load. Lights can be 2x55 watts, or LEDs, which are WAY more efficient. Stereos can be low to high drain, depending on what you have.
I have the long front light that has halogen bulbs(front light/ front turn signals) and then two halogen tail lights/brakes

I found these
https://www.superbrightleds.com/more...yrIaAmf_8P8HAQ

looks like the operate at 12 vdc which would be easy swap. Maybe I can find a bright led 12vdc front light/turn signal light bar
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Old 02-21-2017, 06:14 PM   #9
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

After being used, the battery voltage will increase for an hour or more, however most of the recovery occurs in the first few minutes.

Assuming the voltage fully recovers in 1Hr:
62% is recovered in the first 5-Min.
73% in 10-Min
85% in 15-Min
88% in 20-Min
92% in 30-Min
The remaining 8% take another 30-Min.

How long to wait after the cart stops to take the battery voltage depends on what your are testing for. Immediately after the cart stopped is sufficient for what we were looking for. If there was a bad battery is would have been significantly lower than the rest (>0.5V would be suspicious and needs more investigation while >2.0V is almost guaranteed to be a bad cell)

----------
The 6.37V for a fully charged battery is an average from non-destructive testing by the manufacturer and is for Trojan batteries and clones. Other brands have slightly different voltages.
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Old 02-22-2017, 10:55 PM   #10
Conradconrad
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Default Re: Ezgo pds '07 19mph?

So cables coming, digital volt meter coming, sw800 solenoid with resistor/diode, and I have a serial to USB cable and windows 7 laptop borrowed.

So 36v PDS stock wheel height, stock motor, dcx500, 4 gauge wires throughout, upgraded solenoid. Can you guys recommend a few different controller pro setups to try

Not sure how high to set them.
Looking to have something that gives me the 24mph as I live in south Florida- very flat, driving on a1a with 0.5-4 miles between intersections- so long periods running- not sure if that affects anything

Plug brake sounds a little confusing

Turbo? From what I read it's not really anything, is that correct?

1/2 speed reverse- I think is a great idea

Max current output- any suggestions on %age since I have the dcx500 but stock motor

Under voltage- 34.50 as this is 10% state of charge?

Over voltage- no idea on this one

Throttle rate up- says typically 3-8, so start at 8

Throttle rate down- recommended twice the throttle up rate so if I go 8 on the throttle rate up then it is recommended 15 for throttle rate down?

Brake current- another one I have no idea what %age to set to

Top speed- another one...suggestions?

Throttle response
Sensor type-ezgo its
Throttle response-again open to a few choices or the best choice

Thanks!
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