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Old 05-16-2016, 11:09 AM   #1
Stone
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Default For deep thinkers only



I am still trying to ferret out why my 86 Marathon acts the way it does. Recently over many beers and some good cigars a bunch of us had a lengthy discussion about what could be causing it. Several of us have a solid understanding of small engines and clutches work but we couldn't reach a conclusion. I am opening it up to any of you for opinions.

Here is what I "know":
1. It has plenty of top end.
2. It will pull a short hill just fine.
3. On long hills it goes extremely slow.
4. I have 105psi cold.
5. Both clutches are operating properly (visually)
6. The fact that it runs great, pulls short hills with plenty of power, but soon slows to a crawl (on a long hill), baffles me.

Here is what I "wonder":
1. Could clutch clocking help?
2. I assume that if I clock the clutch to create more "forward" spring pressure, I will lose "reverse" spring pressure?
3. EDITED TO ADD.....Could valve timing have any effect?
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Old 05-16-2016, 02:28 PM   #2
steelpenguin79
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stone View Post


I am still trying to ferret out why my 86 Marathon acts the way it does. Recently over many beers and some good cigars a bunch of us had a lengthy discussion about what could be causing it. Several of us have a solid understanding of small engines and clutches work but we couldn't reach a conclusion. I am opening it up to any of you for opinions.

Here is what I "know":
1. It has plenty of top end.
2. It will pull a short hill just fine.
3. On long hills it goes extremely slow.
4. I have 105psi cold.
5. Both clutches are operating properly (visually)
6. The fact that it runs great, pulls short hills with plenty of power, but soon slows to a crawl (on a long hill), baffles me.

Here is what I "wonder":
1. Could clutch clocking help?
2. I assume that if I clock the clutch to create more "forward" spring pressure, I will lose "reverse" spring pressure?
3. EDITED TO ADD.....Could valve timing have any effect?
Two Questions.

1. It's a 1986.....it should be a 2 cycle robin engine right? if so there would be no valves. But there is a way to adjust the timing, as I just learned how to do over the weekend.

2. The short and long hills......are they the same grade or is the long hill a little steeper?
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Old 05-16-2016, 03:27 PM   #3
rvkersh
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

On a long hill with 22" tires the clutches will shift to a lower range to pull the hill, so slow it is.
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Old 05-16-2016, 05:39 PM   #4
cart around
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

How wide is your drive belt?

There is no clocking on a stock 86 clutch.
The spring is flat on both ends, and rides on teflon washers.
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Old 05-16-2016, 06:41 PM   #5
my1423
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

Do you have a tachometer?
Like to know what the rpms are doing.

Could be the drive clutch is slightly off on the powerband and when you lug just a little it is dropping below peak power and slowing way down.
Clean your drive clutch might have extra grease or dirt adding weight to the pucks.
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Old 05-17-2016, 06:15 AM   #6
Stone
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

Thanks for the thoughts men!

As far as timing, anyone know exactly what it should be?

The hills are similar in steepness, it just seems like it's pulling in third gear.

I have the HP 3004 belt which is 1/2 inch shorter, I will look into a slightly wider belt, can't hurt to keep this one as a spare. This belt is 1.188" wide.

When I finally get this clutch apart, I will see if ity can be clocked, Cartaround helped me see that I have a replacement Comet clutch.

I don't have a long steep hill near my house so I will have to wait until I go back to the cabin to have someone watch while we do the sloooooooooow climb.
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Old 05-17-2016, 06:47 AM   #7
cart around
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

1.188 is 1 3/16". It doesn't get any wider than that.
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Old 05-17-2016, 06:52 AM   #8
Stone
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

Quote:
Originally Posted by cart around View Post
1.188 is 1 3/16". It doesn't get any wider than that.
In looking at the Dayco belt chart I see a few in the proper length range which are 1 1/4 wide, would the 1/16th make a difference?
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Old 05-17-2016, 01:15 PM   #9
Stone
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

Okay, after a day of tinkering and talking to some guys who work on these things, I am beginning to think it's due to the big tires just as rvkersh said. A guy who modifies carts for a living told me the gear ratio is just way off with the 22" tires.

So......here's my question:

There has to be a way to play with the ratio (slightly) with a different belt. Right? In theory, a wider ( and slightly longer) belt should bring back some of the ratio I've lost with the big tires? It's a $35 trial...............

I don't care about top end speed, we use it in the woods.
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Old 05-17-2016, 01:36 PM   #10
tinyxxxviii
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Default Re: For deep thinkers only

for maximum hill climbing you want the belt in the bottom of the motor clutch and at the top of the rear clutch. that would be low gear. that also means the cart will be slow with the engine RPM high. If your motor is slowing down with the cart speed check to see if it is down shifting like I described. a longer belt would inhibit this.
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