lifted club cars - lifted ezgo
Home FAQDonate Who's Online
Go Back   Buggies Gone Wild Golf Cart Forum > Modified Golf Carts > Lifted Golf Carts
Lifted Golf Carts Off-Road Golf Carts.



Post New Thread  Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-23-2016, 05:25 PM   #1
ironmonkey17
Gone Wild
 
ironmonkey17's Avatar
Mixed Breed
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 960
Default Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

looking for help on my front end, I'm on my 3rd front end design wasn't happy with other 2, where i'm at now is I decided to toss the Frame/steering post and both tie rods from atv all together, Now I have both hubs tied together with one rod and I plan on tying the rack an pinion to the passenger side hub, my question is will this work with the A arms or am I gonna have issues. the front end is pretty stiff, I jump up and down on it and it hardly moves, so I'm assuming it won't off set to much on uneven ground to bend anything.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 20160123_164101.jpg (471.6 KB, 0 views)
File Type: jpg 20160123_164125.jpg (560.1 KB, 0 views)
ironmonkey17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Alt Today
BGW

Golf car forum Sponsored Links

__________________
This advertising will not be shown in this way to registered members.
Register your free account today and become a member on Buggies Gone Wild Golf Cart Forum
   
Old 01-23-2016, 10:40 PM   #2
ORTitan
Gone Wild
E-Z-GO
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Oregon
Posts: 230
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

Normally it is not done like that as it can/will impart some weird bump steer. How much affect it will have depends on how much wheel travel you will actually have. The worst that can happen is that after giving it a shot is that you are unhappy with it and will need to start over.

So think about this maybe. Block up your cart at ride height and remove both front shocks. Now with your steering hooked up as you are intending to use it, lift one tire and watch how much steering deflection that causes while the other stays stationary. This will give you a good idea on what is going on. Pay attention that your steering tie rod ends have enough movement in them that they will not bind if one tire were to be all the way up and the other to be all the way down.

Let us know what you find.

Last edited by ORTitan; 01-23-2016 at 10:42 PM.. Reason: spelling
ORTitan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2016, 06:29 AM   #3
ironmonkey17
Gone Wild
 
ironmonkey17's Avatar
Mixed Breed
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 960
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

Thanks ORTitan, I'll give that a shot, didn't think I would have much issue with the bump steer but then again what do I know..All trial and error on my end... I do know if I had long travel shocks I would definitely have issues..I'll let you know what I come up with..might take a day or two before I try it..
ironmonkey17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2016, 10:20 AM   #4
cfherrman
Gone Wild
 
cfherrman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 461
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

Thats how my front end is and it reduces bump steer in the non connected side as that side can travel up and down with the link in the same plane as the a arm, that is what you need. On the connected side i am goint to put a riser so that link is closer to the same plane as well and pretty much all of my bump steer will be gone.
cfherrman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2016, 09:50 PM   #5
ironmonkey17
Gone Wild
 
ironmonkey17's Avatar
Mixed Breed
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 960
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

the way yours is set up does it handle ok or are you all over the road, and to just clear it up on what you said, your gonna set the steering arm that is tied into the steering wheel at the same plan. or a level plan ?, to make it handle a little better.
ironmonkey17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2016, 10:00 PM   #6
cfherrman
Gone Wild
 
cfherrman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 461
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

Handles maybe 25% better, when that side hits a bump it wont bump steer except when the travel gets out of range for single a arm (1-2 inches aprox, dont even know if my springs allow that) when a bump hits the side that is linked into the steering it will bump steer because of the angle of the tie rod to the gearbox. Its a kiss and fast upgrade. When i put a steering riser on that tie rod it should even the angle out and eliminate all bump steer from the tie rod, will only have bump steer left from single a arm travel which we cant get rid of. Im hoping to do a video and install the riser tomorrow night to help explain.
cfherrman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 12:48 PM   #7
ironmonkey17
Gone Wild
 
ironmonkey17's Avatar
Mixed Breed
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 960
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

Sounds good on video...I'm pretty sure I know what your talking about..
ironmonkey17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 06:11 PM   #8
slonomo
Searching for The Way
 
slonomo's Avatar
Yamaha
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Medina, Ohio (NEOHIO)
Posts: 11,421
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

Those drag link setups only work if they have a joint at the pivot point or if you use them with a solid axle like a truck. Some EZGO carts have that setup. You'll need to switch back to individual tie rods.

With the tie rod, the inner joint needs to pivot at the same location as the a arm to minimize bump steer. A rack and pinion will eliminate the progressive angles of the inner tie rod joint. That would be the optimum setup for the single a arm suspension.

I agree that single a arm setup is not meant for much travel, lots of bump steer will result. Sometimes the single a arm suspension is call a "swingarm design" because the arm travels in an arc, which is what causes the tire to look like this / \ or \ / during suspension travel. The spindle is in a fixed position on the a arm and the tire doesn't move laterally with suspension travel. Bad design really. Good for golf carts with 2" of travel though. Simple. Beyond 2" of travel things get really out of whack.

I was tired of messing with mine and have since converted to an atv dual a arm setup....WAY BETTER! I know the atv conversion isn't for everyone, but it sure is the way to go....or the long travel Jakes kit if one is available.

That bump steer on the single a arm setup is very dangerous at higher speeds. I do not recommend it if you are going to drive faster than 20 mph. If you hit a bump at speed the cart will want to dart one direction or another, causing you to over-correct, which causes more bump steer....etc etc. Not good on a short wheelbase and narrow vehicle.
slonomo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 06:37 PM   #9
cfherrman
Gone Wild
 
cfherrman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 461
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

Your exactly right slowmo, draglink is for a solid axle. I took the springs off and jacked up the front a few inches and was checking the bump steer. I decided to nix the video as i ended up being wrong, i may do one this summer before i get my double a arms.

With draglink on drivers side and no riser on pass side:

Driver tire turns little as the tire moves up and down, pretty nice.
Pass tire turns silghtly more but causes the driver tire to turn a lot

Results, bump hit on drivers side does not cause bump steer but on the pass side causes probably the same bump steer on the pass tire as before but more on the driver tire.

With riser (1x3x3 3/16ths rectangle tubing 1x4 might be better) on pass side and drag link:

Driver side is the same.
Pass tire does not turn with up and down movement.
Compressing spring all the way down still did not cause the pass tire to turn while the driver side did, although little.


Results, fix a lifted single a arm with risers, i got mine free and you could too at a fabrication shop, this should hold you over until double a arms come along.


cfherrman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2016, 07:47 AM   #10
slonomo
Searching for The Way
 
slonomo's Avatar
Yamaha
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Medina, Ohio (NEOHIO)
Posts: 11,421
Default Re: Steering and rack help on atv/cart build

There is no real solution to the single a arm bump steer, it will always exist. However, you can minimize it. Here's how:

1. Remove shocks and position the a arms in the "middle" of the travel, where the tires are straight up and down. Take note of the tie rod position.

2. The tie rod at this point "should" be parallel with the a arm, with no difference in angle. If not, correct this with spacers/risers/etc.

3. Now is when you need to measure the distance between the shock mounts. This is the distance you need when at "ride height", or when the shocks are installed and weight is added to the vehicle with "normal load". Install the shocks and set the vehicle on the ground. Stand on the front end a few times. The shocks will compress. Measure the distance between the shock mounts again. Calculate the difference between the two measurements, this is the length of the spacer for the shocks that will correct the "real ride height". (Note: this will all change if you change shocks, so make sure you pick out the shocks you will be using. Ideally, the shocks you should use will be the stock cart shocks because they were designed for that design front end, with very little travel.)

4. Fab the shock spacers/extensions and install. Put vehicle on the ground and load. Check the tire to make sure that it is perpendicular to the ground.
Adjust shock spacer/extensions as needed. Adjust shock preload as needed.

5. Toe need to be set dead straight, with maybe a hair "Toe In". If it's not perfect, it will affect handling. I used a 10' piece of square tubing, attach it to the outside edge of each front tire with a ratchet strap so that they are parallel to the ground and have 7 feet sticking out in front. Then measure the centerline of the vehicle and mark on the ground. Now measure the distances of the square tubing and the center line and adjust your tie rods to get the toe dead straight. Compress the front suspension several times and re-measure. Adjust as needed. Test drive.

*remember that setting the toe on a rough concrete surface will be difficult because of "tire scrub". (google it for explanation) Try to set it in the grass, or on a smooth slippery surface to minimize scrub.

**too much toe in = suspension will compress when going forward, and handling will suffer, tires will likely look like this / \

***too much toe out = suspension will compress when going backward, and forward handling will be very twitchy and difficult to handle

****worn out shocks will make your life miserable, and you won't be able to keep the tires where you want them and will likely look like this / \
slonomo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Go Back   Buggies Gone Wild Golf Cart Forum > Modified Golf Carts > Lifted Golf Carts


Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Forum
WTB CC Steering Rack Golf Carts and Parts
Steering Rack Electric EZGO
wtb steering rack Golf Carts and Parts
Which Steering Rack Do I Need? Electric EZGO
steering rack Gas Club Car


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:27 AM.


Club Car Electric | EZGO Electric | Lifted Golf Carts | Gas EZGO | Used Golf Carts and Parts

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This Website and forum is the property of Buggiesgonewild.com. No material may be taken or duplicated in part or full without prior written consent of the owners of buggiesgonewild.com. © 2006-2017 Buggiesgonewild.com. All rights reserved.