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Unread 03-07-2019, 11:41 AM   #21
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

Quote:
Originally Posted by MyCousinVinnie View Post
So my BMS is here, and I'm starting to map out the wiring. I have questions. Attached is a schematic. Don't pay much attention to the 1-14 going to the cells, as I've run that by the manufacturer and they are good. Also, unlike a Zeva, the Chargery runs the negative through the shunt, not the positive. My questions are:

(1) Can I run a wire directly from the shunt to the charger and a second 2g wire directly from the shunt to B- on the controller?

I had to keep referring to my schematic as my shunt (as you stated) is on the + (pos) side and yours is on the - (neg) side. You can do what your saying.....but on my setup I have a relay between my charger and shunt. This is my HV cutoff. I see your HV cutoff is built into the BMS. I would suggest that you refer to your heavy duty power cables as "cables" and your other wiring as "wire". Helps prevent confusion.

(2) Can I run two separate wires directly from the B+ one directly to the charger and one to the LV relay? The HV relay is built into the Chargery charger.

I believe that is correct. The + side HV from the charger is controlled (as you state) by the charger. Now, in order to get + power to your relay it can come from anywhere.....as long as the - supply comes from your BMS that controls your LV cutoff.

(3) Should I put the LV relay somewhere else? I think I read somewhere that it should be somewhere else to potentially stop battery drain.

Your LV relay won't work unless there is power to it. The power comes from a +(pos) somewhere and the -(neg) from your BMS. So, as long as your BMS is powered up, the BMS itself is what will draw power. Not the relay. The relay is just a "dumb switch" that closes when there is power to it, and opens when the power stops.

(4) I currently don't have a fuse between my lead acids and my solenoid. I've seen builds with a fuse on it. Is it necessary when you convert to lithium?

My LA had a 400amp fuse between the +(pos) battery cable and the controller. My lithium setup has the same. The only items on my solenoid is a diode for current spikes and a pre-charge resistor to help prevent the solenoid from welding together when I hit the go switch.
Finally, I'm probably going to put an anderson connector on so I can disconnect the pack, but that's not in the attachment.
A disconnect is very nice as a convenience factor. I don't have one so if I want to disconnect the pack, I need a wrench. And you gotta be very careful with wrench's around a Lithium pack.

My answers in RED above. I hope this helps!!
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Unread 03-07-2019, 09:47 PM   #22
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

Thanks, Dave. Now, I've got to figure why Chargery sent me this massive thing they call a relay, but which I would call a 12volt 600amp solenoid. It's in the manual, so i guess it's right. manual is here. It's just confusing to me, probably because I am not an electrical expert. I specifically asked him about this and wondered why it should be 12v and not 48v. He said

for New BMS16T, the relay controller voltage is 12 V, you do not need 48 V relay, and the relay controller can output 3A max. current on NEW BMS16T.

My guess is that what he is saying is that the relay controller in the BMS uses 12volts to open the relay, and a maximum of 3amps. And the reason the thing is 600amps is that its from the positive side of the battery to the load.

I hope someone more knowledgeable will come along and tell me that's right.
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Unread 03-08-2019, 06:17 AM   #23
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

According to the manual when you use between 8-16 cells the BMS has an internal 12v voltage reducer that is used for powering the relays.

The relay(s) are powered the entire time the BMS is ON, regardless if the cart is On or Off as long as the individual cell voltages are between the set limits.

You want to press that "stop" button while parked and not charging to reduce the discharge on the pack.
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Unread 03-08-2019, 06:56 AM   #24
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

^^^^^-----What he said-----^^^^^^
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Unread 03-08-2019, 09:48 AM   #25
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

Thanks, Sergio. Here's another question, so I turn the BMS OFF, I should be OK? Or should I put some kind of disconnect in there? I've looked at Anderson disconnects and I can't find a high amp one. Also, I wonder if there is some way to rig up an "off" button on the dash for the BMS. that would be cool.
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Unread 03-08-2019, 10:03 AM   #26
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

Pressing the "stop" button will power down that big solenoid which will remove power going to Controller and voltage reducer (like disconnecting your existing pack positive battery cable).

The only power being drawn at that point is the quiescent current used by the BMS itself which should be very small.

The first time you leave the cart OFF (stop mode) for several days, just measure the pack voltage before and after to see if any significant drop occurred with the pack.
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Unread 03-08-2019, 03:12 PM   #27
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

Thanks so much. Looks like there is also a way to turn the BMS off by switching it to external power, or at least that's what the manual seems to say. We shall see when I start putting it all together next week.
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Unread 03-12-2019, 09:48 AM   #28
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

So, I've stripped the old cart down and starting measuring things. If you will recall, I've had to split my pack because it will not fit in one piece in a 1993 club car ds electric. (It will in a gas). I split it at 8 modules and 6 modules. Unlike the 7 module set, the 8 module set will not fit in the middle without some modification, which I'm currently figuring out right now.

More importantly, however, I am trying to figure how how to secure the pack. Attached is a picture of one my sets of modules. As you can see, the rod through the pack is just long enough to bolt the end plate to the pack. that's the same on all the bolts.

Do you have any simple suggestions for securing the pack? the only one I can currently think of is to go by some longer threaded rods. My question then would be, however, is their some torque specification for the pack? Obviously, I don't want to tighten the nut on the rods too much.

I'm probably going with a wooden encasement like the one in this thread, as it is the simplest for me to build.

Thanks so much.
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Unread 03-12-2019, 12:20 PM   #29
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

Pack securing......Bob Boyce said it best. He stated to use 8mm (yes metric). I used 5/16" but the American thread pitch is "sharper" than the metric pitch. The thin case metal want's to bind up on the 5/16" where Bob stated the 8mm went on like a greasy hot dog.

I did get my 5/16" to work....but I had to grind off the all-thread sharp edges. Avoid all that and get 8mm.

For the tightness.....I just took 'em up snug and checked there would be no openings from any wiggles it would go through.
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Unread 03-12-2019, 12:38 PM   #30
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Default Re: Lithium hunting cart overhaul

Why wouldn't something like this work? And yes, I realize that is a smaller battery, but concept is the same. Also, Dave, I have to admit I'm a little worried about undoing the compression of the modules. I would assume there are some kind of specs for retightening them, and I don't know them and can't find them online.
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