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Unread 01-06-2020, 08:59 AM   #1
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Default Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

Is this the basic wiring involved in a BMS (Chargery, for example) managed lithium pack?

Questions would be:

1) What are the coil voltages for the cut-out solenoids (Chargery unit in this case...)?

2) The charger cut-out solenoid doesn't have to be a crazy high-amp unit I'm assuming? The load side / discharge one Does, I take it, same as the one in the cart (which I've upgraded to a super HD one). My controller is 600amp max, but probably never gets to that point, and if so only for a second or so I'd guess...

3) I suppose any communication between charger and BMS is optional, and depends on your charger and BMS. What is the advantage of choosing BMS and charger that DO communicate? I assume you could still use a programmable voltage cut off charger, but otherwise a non-communicating / dumb charger and just not use the BMS's ability to control a charger, and the BMS would connect / disconnect / balance even when using this type of charger?

4) BMS power - what's the consensus on this? Power with the lithium pack's total voltage? Some kind of separate power source?

Thanks for any thoughtful schooling or assessment of my understanding - I'm getting closer to ordering a bunch of stuff I don't know much about that will chew up a lot of time when it shows up on my doorstep...
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Unread 01-06-2020, 02:57 PM   #2
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

You are missing a current shunt. See page 2 of this diagram. and if you use the chargery charger, you don't need a charge relay/cut off. It's built in.

there are some threads on here with the zeva showing you your set up with that BMS. Maybe try DaveTM's.
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Unread 01-06-2020, 03:22 PM   #3
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

As 'Cousin stated here is the diagram of my unit using the ZEVA. The BMS takes it's power from the Lithium pack and not a separate power source. The ZEVA has a "Sleep" function that I use. I simply turn off the switch and the power to the BMS and monitor is shutdown while the BMS still retains it's settings.

I think this may help and if you don't understand something, ask away. In my build I think I ask about a billion questions.

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Unread 01-08-2020, 09:02 AM   #4
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

Quote:
Originally Posted by MyCousinVinnie View Post
You are missing a current shunt. See page 2 of this diagram. and if you use the chargery charger, you don't need a charge relay/cut off. It's built in.

there are some threads on here with the zeva showing you your set up with that BMS. Maybe try DaveTM's.
Thanks - I found that same Chargery diagram after scribbling my own. Makes sense, and thanks for pointing out that the charge cut off relay / solenoid isn't needed if you use that charger.

Do you have that charger mounted onboard the cart?
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Unread 01-08-2020, 09:03 AM   #5
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveTM View Post
As 'Cousin stated here is the diagram of my unit using the ZEVA. The BMS takes it's power from the Lithium pack and not a separate power source. The ZEVA has a "Sleep" function that I use. I simply turn off the switch and the power to the BMS and monitor is shutdown while the BMS still retains it's settings.

I think this may help and if you don't understand something, ask away. In my build I think I ask about a billion questions.

Thanks - are those diodes Zeva specific?
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Unread 01-08-2020, 12:59 PM   #6
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

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Originally Posted by fstop View Post
Thanks - are those diodes Zeva specific?
No. I got 'em off of Amazon. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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Unread 01-08-2020, 09:32 PM   #7
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

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Originally Posted by DaveTM View Post
But are they required for the Zeva installation specifically (haven't seen diodes in any diagrams for the Chargery BMS I don't think).

Sorry for confusion.
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Unread 01-09-2020, 05:23 PM   #8
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

For the ZEVA setup....it's kinda like a loop. Here's a picture that may clear up your understanding.

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Unread 01-10-2020, 07:34 AM   #9
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

fstop, any relay with a DC coil should have a flyback diode reversed bias and wired across the relay coil to prevent a high voltage buildup on the device turning the relay ON/OFF.

This is particularly critical if the DC coil relay is being activated by an SSR (Solid State Relay) as is the case in the Zeva controller.

Some solenoids with an internal "economizer" coil driver don't need it since the flyback diode functionality is already built into the solenoid (check relay/solenoid specs for any built in protection).
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Unread 01-10-2020, 09:37 AM   #10
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Default Re: Lithium / BMS basic wiring diagram

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Originally Posted by Sergio View Post
fstop, any relay with a DC coil should have a flyback diode reversed bias and wired across the relay coil to prevent a high voltage buildup on the device turning the relay ON/OFF.

This is particularly critical if the DC coil relay is being activated by an SSR (Solid State Relay) as is the case in the Zeva controller.

Some solenoids with an internal "economizer" coil driver don't need it since the flyback diode functionality is already built into the solenoid (check relay/solenoid specs for any built in protection).
Thank you - that's exactly what I was looking for.

I've just generally not seen the diodes in most of the wiring diagrams floating around here. I guess most people drawing them and reading them know this already, but I only know enough to know I see them sometimes and not others - thanks for explanation about the in-built diodes.

I'm probably going to be using the Chargery BMS16, which I currently have, and I assume it has some kind of SSR inside to switch 12v to the disconnect solenoids (there is no "click" when it activates, anyway).

The relay or solenoid - not sure of proper term in this case - needs a 12v coil in the case of the Chargery diconnect output - what would the specs be on the proper diode to put a across the coil terminals, and how should it be oriented?

Thanks for all your input here - it is incredibly helpful.
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