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Old 06-21-2010, 05:55 PM   #1
jiminpa
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Default Can I ground the field to test the generator?

I will try to make this short and to the point. I just got a '92 gas club car, unknown history other then starting problems. (it looks like several people have monkeyed with it) It is not charging, in fact, it seems to be actively discharging. (ie. 12.7V on start, 12.2 V on idle, 10 V at higher rpm, back to 12.2 at idle again) I believe it has the correct generator. ( same part # as a known working generator) My question is can I do a simple generator test by grounding the Field on the generator? Like you used to do years ago on cars/tractors, etc. If so, can I just disconnect the yellow field wire from the regulator and ground it or do I need to disconnect other feeds too.

Thanks.
Jim
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Old 06-21-2010, 11:04 PM   #2
jiminpa
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

more info here...
I did the following tests. All test procedures indicate no problem with starter/generator.
~~~~~~~~~~~~

1. Place the neutral lock-out cam in the SERVICE position, put the forward and reverse lever in the NEUTRAL
position, and chock the wheels.
2. Check that wires are connected correctly and are tight. If they are not, rewire or tighten as necessary.
3. Disconnect the wires from all the terminals on the starter/generator. Then place the black (-) probe of a
multimeter, set to ohms (Ω), on the starter/generator housing (scratch through the paint to insure a
good ground). While holding the black probe against the housing, place the red (+) probe (one at a
time) on the A1, A2, F1, F2 and DF terminals respectively (Figure 12-25, Page 100). The readings
should be no continuity. If the readings are incorrect, the starter/generator will need to be removed
from the vehicle and disassembled by a qualified technician (See Removal of the Starter/Generator,
Page 107).
An incorrect reading from A1 or A2 terminal indicates three possible problems: 1) a grounded A1 or A2
terminal, 2) a grounded wire in the brush area, or 3) a grounded armature/commutator.
If the F1 or F2 reading is incorrect, it indicates a possible grounded F1 or F2 terminal or a grounded
field coil.
If the DF reading is incorrect, it indicates a possible grounded DF terminal or a grounded field coil.
4. Disconnect the ground wire from the A2 terminal and the green wire from the A1 terminal on the
starter/generator. Using a multimeter set to ohms (Ω), place the red (+) probe on the A1 terminal and
the black (-) probe on the A2 terminal. The reading should be continuity.
If the reading is incorrect, a possible open or poor contact in a brush assembly and/or open armature
windings maybe the cause. The starter/generator will need to be removed from the vehicle and disassembled
by a qualified technician (See Removal of the Starter/Generator, Page 107).
5. Disconnect the green wire from the F1 terminal and the white wire from the F2 terminal on the starter/
generator. Using a multimeter set on ohms (Ω), place the red (+) probe on the F1 terminal and the
black (-) probe on the F2 terminal. The reading should be continuity.
If the reading is incorrect, a possible open field coil or bad connections at terminals may be the cause.
The starter/generator will need to be removed from the vehicle and disassembled by a qualified technician(See Removal of the Starter/Generator, Page 107).
`````````
still looking for thoughts on grounding the field.
thanks,
jim
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Old 06-22-2010, 05:43 AM   #3
ohio93clubcar
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

I have a 93ds and am had a similar problem, an easy way to check the generator is to disconnect the yellow wire from the generator, connect a test lead from where you disconnected the yellow wire to ground. Measure your voltage at the battery, you should see greater than 15 volts if the generator is working correctly. I think this is a legit test, someone correct me if I'm wrong.
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:19 AM   #4
lockman1
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

It looks like you have a Maintenance Service manual Jim...

Did you check the voltage regulator?



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Old 06-22-2010, 08:17 AM   #5
jiminpa
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

Lockman1,
I don't have a manual of any sort. I did find the generator test procedure here at buggiesgonewild. :-)
At this point I am betting on the regulator, however, since it is a no-return item, I wanted to be as sure as possible before I put one on to see if it fixes it. Because of the unknown history on this cart, I am uneasy about just putting a new regulator on it. I have been told that the last guy that fooled with it had no mechanical experience and I see evidence of that. It does look like the regulator has been replaced at some point not to long ago, so, I am trying to make sure everything is wired correctly, etc. before putting a regulator on. does anyone have any resistance tolerance readings on the regulator? Often times solid state devices can be tested by looking at resistance levels between some of the connections. The regulator test that you posted does not really test the regulator itself, it is more like a by default type of test, where you believe everything else to be ok and so if the results are not as they should be, logically, it must be the regulator. But, because I don't know what these other people may have changed, I don't know that everything is wired correctly, etc. That's why I was asking about testing the generator with the old ground the field method or testing the regulator itself via resistance readings.

Thanks,
jim
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Old 06-22-2010, 08:22 AM   #6
jiminpa
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

Ohio93clubcar,
That is the procedure I was talking about. That yellow wire goes to the "field" wire on the generator. By grounding the field, you complete the circuit and allow the generator to work. At least that is the way it used to work years ago. But, with that solid state regulator, I was not sure that it still worked that way and did not want to mess something up in the generator.

Thanks,
Jim
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:13 PM   #7
lockman1
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

All I have in my manuals, is that test, and installation of it... no resistance values...
The wording in the test procedure seems a little confusing,
but, from reading it over and over:

"If the reading is lower than 14.7 volts and not rising... and the S/G is good,
OR...
if the reading is above 15.3 volts, and continues to rise, replace the voltage regulator."

I omitted some of the parts, but this is what I feel it means!
and that sure seems like your situation!

And around $25 to $30 bucks isn't that much for it!

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Old 06-22-2010, 04:32 PM   #8
shadowman
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

its rare for the genertor side of the starter to go bad but its very common for the voltage regulator to go bad so if the cart isn,t charging and your sure the battery is good i would just go ahead and replace V.R. if fact i can,t recall ever seeing the gen. side of the starter go bad.............................
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Old 06-22-2010, 05:32 PM   #9
jiminpa
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

I would be surprised if the starter/generator actually used different windings and so since it spins as a motor, it should charge as a generator. They never used different circuts 40 some odd years ago when they put them on lawn mowers and no reason I know of why they would add extra wire to the units now. Any old style generator will normally act as a electric motor if fed electric. (off topic) Infact, it is common to make 3 phase electric by simply connecting the shafts of a 3 phase motor to the shaft of a regular 220 electric motor. When the 220 motor spins, it will turn the 3 phase motor and pump out 3 phase electric. That way us guys out in the sticks can get 3 phase electric for our bridgeports and lathes. :-) I will probably take a chance on the VR and put one in. I will let you guys know what happens.

Jim
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:48 PM   #10
kcirtap390
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Default Re: Can I ground the field to test the generator?

can a voltage reg . short out and discharge a batt,?
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