Onward front disc brakes

[AnotherJoe]

Talked to them again and was told Jakes, Everything Carts and Buggies Unlimited are all the same company. So he saved me 10% by going to BU, 6 week lead time right now so we will see.

Took 4 months to get the new Onward after being told it would be 3-4 weeks and I sold my Yamaha at four weeks after placing the order. Sassers in Goldsboro was good enough to give me a LI Tempo loaner for about 3 months until we got the Onward though.

[Beeg]

Originally Posted by AnotherJoe

Hello all, new here from Cary, NC. Looking for some advice on putting front brakes on our new ride.

Cart is a 2021 LI ION Onward with gears and it's a little much for the factory rear drums alone.

I'm sure there's threads on here about the conversation so if anyone could point me in the right direction it would be much appreciated.

Thanks for any help! :)

Can you give more details on the gears you replaced on your Onward?

[AnotherJoe]

8:1 Apache, cart flies, but doesn't stop to well.

[fstop]

Originally Posted by AnotherJoe

8:1 Apache, cart flies, but doesn't stop to well.

Another thing to consider relating to braking are your tires.

Your sig. photo shows stock Onward tires, which are the same ones that came on mine also, but I replaced them in short order mainly due to noise.

In addition to killing the loud howling sound, what I also found was that cornering and braking were both noticeably improved with the DOT rated radial "Street Fox" tires I replaced them with. My set also happened to be a bit "rounder" than the stock ones, so high speed street use is super smooth.

The cross section of the stock tires has a more rounded contour, meaning mostly the center part of the tires is on the pavement, with less contact toward the edges. The Street Fox tires have basically a square contact pattern - edge to edge. The stock tread pattern itslef also seems to have somewhat less contact with the street (but it's better than many AT type tires though - the ones with individual "bumps"), and the rubber compound seemed less grippy or harder than the Street Fox tires.

A downside (also unanticipated) to the performance profile / wide contact area of the tires is a firmer ride. The crown in many of the AT type tires provides some flex. You win some, you lose some.

All this to say that the tire-to-road connection is an important part of the friction / resistance producing process that stops the cart.

I didn't expect braking or cornering would change, since mainly it was the noise that drove me to change tires, but both aspects of handling improved - braking in particular.

I'll say I also was able to further improve braking by linking brake pedal movement to the Navitas controller's application of Regen, meaning that the regen braking setting is increased proportionally with brake pedal pressure, but remains at a selected fixed level otherwise.

Between the grippier tires and brake-actuated regen control, I'm confident in braking with only the stock brakes. At 36 or 37 mph though, there's no doubt it's prudent to be very careful - no matter how many wheels you have brakes on, or what kind they are.

[AnotherJoe]

Thanks for the info on the tires, not sure radial street tires would make that much of a difference. Front brakes on the other hand would help stop the cart from getting sideways during hard stops and especially on wet pavement.

A buddy at our club has the same cart with the street fox tires and it is a lot quieter and handles much better, but he has the same issue when it comes to stopping his cart.

I'll talk to my service guy at our dealer about the regen control to get his thoughts. They wouldn't touch the front brakes because of warranty concerns, so I'll end up doing them myself this winter if I can actually get a set of the brakes.

Cheers!

[fstop]

Originally Posted by AnotherJoe

Thanks for the info on the tires, not sure radial street tires would make that much of a difference. Front brakes on the other hand would help stop the cart from getting sideways during hard stops and especially on wet pavement.

A buddy at our club has the same cart with the street fox tires and it is a lot quieter and handles much better, but he has the same issue when it comes to stopping his cart.

I'll talk to my service guy at our dealer about the regen control to get his thoughts. They wouldn't touch the front brakes because of warranty concerns, so I'll end up doing them myself this winter if I can actually get a set of the brakes.

Cheers!

I can only say my tires in combo with the regen made a difference in minimum stopping distance. Never tested in rain or braking into a curve however.

I don't think there is anyway to modulate regen with brake input on the stock controller.

I've never seen anybody mention it, but the 6 passenger Onwards
have drum brakes (presumably same units as are on the rear) on all 4 wheels from the factory due to the extra weight of the cart and passengers. I don't know if the parts are reasonable, or what else might be involved, but I'm not sure disc brakes on the front would be much better than the drums. Probably either would get you the extra stopping power you are after. I can say that disc brakes aren't always better. I have an ebike with them (hydraulic) and they are a pain. They don't stay aligned for long, make racket when stopping, and no doubt will be a bear when I have to bleed the lines. I'm sure there are better discs out there, but the design and parts quality of the set you choose will make a big difference in your overall satisfaction I would expect.

The Chinese "Icon" carts have 4-wheel discs, which seems great in theory, but if they are anything like the Chinese discs on my bike (and I don't know anything about the Icons), it would be a nightmare.

[WalterM6]

Disc Brakes making noise no problem.

[AnotherJoe]

So the brake kit came in, crazy lots of Wildwood parts. Got my brother coming down from MD in a few weeks to help with the install. Fortunately he's done a bunch of 4 wheel disc conversions on old muscle cars :)

[CartsRFun]

Originally Posted by fstop

The Chinese "Icon" carts have 4-wheel discs, which seems great in theory, but if they are anything like the Chinese discs on my bike (and I don't know anything about the Icons), it would be a nightmare.

Not just great in theory ...but experientially proven!!

My ICON I40's are very smooth quiet, progressive braking feel....
Had my I40 at 29 mph still accelerating, had to do quick stop for a
stop sign....the I40's disc brakes took it all instride...no muss no fuss..
very smooth operation...

Hopefully yours will provide same or better response!!

Happy cartin'

[fstop]

Originally Posted by CartsRFun

Not just great in theory ...but experientially proven!!

My ICON I40's are very smooth quiet, progressive braking feel....
Had my I40 at 29 mph still accelerating, had to do quick stop for a
stop sign....the I40's disc brakes took it all instride...no muss no fuss..
very smooth operation...

Hopefully yours will provide same or better response!!

Happy cartin'

Good to know they seem to be working well for you.