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Old 07-09-2011, 01:00 PM   #21
SKUNKVILLE SCOOTER
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

[QUOTE=JohnnieB;590739]
Simply stated, the power lines to your radio/audio devices serve as an antenna for RFI and/or the secondary of a transformer for EMI.

*Route the power cables as far away from the motor and controller as possible.
*If power lines to Radio/audio equipment must cross motor/controller power cables, do so at 90 degree angles. At least, do not run them side by side for any significant length.
*Use a twisted pair for the power line to the radio/audio device. Also, shielded cables (coaxial) might work if the current draw of the device isn't too high.
*Install a power line filter (DC type) as close to the power input as possible.
*Power radio/audio equipment from separate (totally isolated) battery.
*Use a 2-wire power cable rather than frame ground. [QUOTE]

SIMPLY...?? My last two remaining braincells are smoke'in.....

But, it all makes very good sense to me and I'm go'na put this information in my 'Words of Wisdom File', cause I'll never remember all of it...

JohnnieB, you are the best.
I couldn't buy information like this and it's free here at BGW...!

Thanks.
Danny aka: SKUNKVILLE SCOOTER
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Old 07-09-2011, 02:23 PM   #22
JohnnieB
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

Thanks for the kind words "Skunk"

Just for the heck of it, I took a quick ride with some hearing protectors with built in radio that I use while mowing the lawn. Powered by self contained AA batteries and totally isolated from cart electrical system, but couldn't pick up an AM station whose antenna is less than 5 miles away while accelerating and picked up a whine whose frequency varied with cart speed while cruising.
MP3 input worked okay, but faint whining noise was still detectable in background during acceleration. (Brushes arcing???? Are they difficult to check or change???)

Also tried some electronic hearing protectors I use at the shooting range. Roughly same results as with MP3 input to my mowing earmuffs.

I had no idea electric golf carts were so noisy. Looks like I'll have to jack the rear wheel up and use a radio with a directional antenna to isolate the RFI source.
(Wish I still had access to some of the test equipment I've used in the past. )

FWIW: FM radio is far less susceptible to RFI than AM radio, but a strong electrical interference signal will shut down both.
When done intentionally, it is called Jamming.
When it is unintentional or incidental it is called RFI or EMI.
In either case, the effect is pretty much the same.
Devices such as audio amps, CD players, MP3 players and other things that don't receive RF signals, are the least susceptible to RFI/EMI.

Out of curiosity, has anyone experienced Cell Phone reception problems on a golf cart? (They are radio receiver/transmitters, but operate at much higher frequency than AM, FM, CB and Business bands.)
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Old 07-09-2011, 07:10 PM   #23
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

This begs the question as to whether the new 3 phase AC motors will experience the same issues..... Technically, the new RXV runs on a 3 phase brushless motor so it should not be getting RF interference at all.... Gives me a new thing to test for.....
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Old 07-10-2011, 07:07 AM   #24
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbitreborn View Post
This begs the question as to whether the new 3 phase AC motors will experience the same issues..... Technically, the new RXV runs on a 3 phase brushless motor so it should not be getting RF interference at all.... Gives me a new thing to test for.....
Yep, a brushless motor won't generate nearly as much RFI as a brush type motor, but it will generate some since, technically, everything with electricity running through it radiates electrical noise. For practical purposes, it probably won't be enough to interfere with radio reception or be heard on audio devices.

On the other hand, you've got to convert the DC from the battery to AC for the motor and control the amount of current the motor can draw, so my guess is that the inverter/controller (or whatever it's called) for an AC type motor will most likely put out about the same amount of RFI as a DC controller for a brush type motor. Of course, there is the possibility that the designers included adequate filtering and shielding, but I doubt it.

For testing, RFI is fairly easy to hear on an AM receiver tuned between radio stations. If no RFI is present, you'll hear a hissing sound (White Noise). If there is RFI, you'll hear White Noise plus squeals, whines, pulses, static, pops, whistles and/or any of a multitude of other sounds.
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Old 07-11-2011, 04:53 PM   #25
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

Hello, the radio on the golf cart is a jensen jms2212, 50wx2, . I have tried the best buy rf surpressor, tried ysing an indepentant battery solet for the radio, tried grounding wire reacement, cart name Club Car IR,aq0620-628620. Can anyone come up with other ideas why my radio sound dies down when i accelerate. I can play the am.fm.mp3 player. I doesnt matter what is on but when i accelrate the music dies down. Help.
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Old 07-12-2011, 01:03 AM   #26
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by floresm View Post
Hello, the radio on the golf cart is a jensen jms2212, 50wx2, . I have tried the best buy rf surpressor, tried ysing an indepentant battery solet for the radio, tried grounding wire reacement, cart name Club Car IR,aq0620-628620. Can anyone come up with other ideas why my radio sound dies down when i accelerate. I can play the am.fm.mp3 player. I doesnt matter what is on but when i accelrate the music dies down. Help.
Let me verify that I have the symptoms straight: In all 3 of the modes listed above (AM Radio, FM Radio and MP3 Player); The sound level from your speaker system decreases, but doesn't go completely silent, when your cart accelerates?

If so, where exactly are the following components of your system physically located in and/or on your cart?
1. The head unit. (Faceplate with controls/displays)
2. The electronics package. (Radio receiver/Audio Amplifier/Etc.)
3. The Speakers.
4. The AM and FM Antennae.
5. Wiring (Power, signal and interconnecting)
Pictures would be most helpful......

*Also, Do your hear electrical noise (whines, squeals or rhythmic pulsing) from your speakers when the volume decreases during acceleration, or do they simply get quieter?


If possible, temporarily substitute the current speakers with a set of headphones or a different set of speakers that are located forward of the passenger compartment. (IE: Small ones hanging near the top of the front roof supports & existing speakers completely disconnected from system!)
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Old 07-12-2011, 08:48 AM   #27
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

Yes , sound decreases but doesnt go silent.1)face plate-controls of unit located in front dash of golfcart 2)the electronics underneath the driver-passenger seat3)the speakers face the dash just installed under the seat.4)the antenna on the outside just to the left of the driver-to the left side of the driver next to the back seat.5) power wires etc just located under the seat. I tried something else, disconnected the power supply control box located it in front of the cart, used an indepentant battery and still the same.
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Old 07-12-2011, 09:29 AM   #28
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

im reading and answering telephones, so, i may have misread this. i think i read that you are using a external amp. if so, you will need to go to a real car stereo shop and purchase some really good rca cables. jensen radios are ok, but the rca cables mean the world to amps. amps will also pick up any outside noise present. also, never ever run the rca cables next to voltage wires. they will pick up everything. i battled these issues all the years i played with car audio. ive competed in compitions both pro and street. the use of good wiring and how it is routed is the key to quality sound. better brands of equipment mean nothing if you dont use quality wiring. i know it gets pricey, but, spend the few extra dollars. i know your not trying to compete, but you have taken the time and spent a few bucks already. finish it with good wiring. best buy sell ok stuff, but local car stereo shops sell some of the best stuff available.
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Old 07-12-2011, 11:58 AM   #29
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

Blake80's advice is sound (Pardon the pun )

The problem you are experiencing doesn't seem to be in the typical RFI/EMI problem realm since the things you say you've tried done should have eliminated, or at least mitigated, the problem. Therefore, I'll carry blake80's advice a step further and say it's time to call Jensen and/or call in a sound system installation professional.

I'm not familiar with the Battery/Controller/Motor layout in a Club Car, but I suspect it is similar to an EZGO. (BTW - This is the Electric EZGO area - The Electric Club Car area is the one immediately above this one on the Repair and Troubleshooting menu, but the problem probably isn't cart specific.)

Here's what can be eliminated from reading your posts:
*The problem exists in the MP3 Player mode, so the placement of the AM/FM antenna isn't a factor.
*You've powered the audio system from a battery that is not in any way connected the the cart's main battery, so there is not a drop in battery voltage to the audio system during acceleration.
*You've relocated the Radio Receiver/Audio Amp box out of the RFI/EMI rich environment under the driver/passenger seat. This should have at least changed the problem.
*You don't hear any electrical noise in the speakers, only a reduction in volume. This doesn't eliminate EMI being picked up on the low level audio cables and saturating the front-end of the audio amp, but it lowers the probability of them being the problem source. (Like blake80 suggested, I'd still replace the low-level audio cable with high quality, fully shielded aftermarket ones.)

Unless my mental picture is wrong, we've eliminated just about everything except the speakers, but I doubt if a cart controller, motor or battery cabling is going to produce a magnetic field strong enough to adversely effect their output, unless they have some sort of electronic gadgets built into them other than a permanent magnet and speaker coil. However, 300 amps flowing through a wire would produce a pretty strong magnetic field and if the speaker was within that magnetic field, strange things could happen.

Another thing that I'm not sure about is the interconnecting wires between the dash mounted faceplate and the box containing the electronics. There is a volume control on the faceplate that tells the electronics in the box to turn the volume up or down. If RFI/EMI was getting on the volume control wire, it is possible that a false signal is sent to the audio amp, telling it to lower the volume (Without any electrical noise being heard since the volume control signal either a DC level or digital code rather than the actual audio signal.)

If it were mine, I would duct tape the entire system (battery, speakers and all) to the top front of the roof and see if the problem still existed.
If it did, I'd be on the phone to Jensen in a heartbeat.
If it didn't, I'd reinstall the various parts of the system one at a time, playing careful attention to component and wire placement.

If that didn't work, I'd take it to a reputable car/boat stereo installer and let them figure it out.

Last edited by JohnnieB; 07-12-2011 at 12:12 PM.. Reason: spelin
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Old 07-12-2011, 01:13 PM   #30
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Default Re: stereo installation problems

Called jensen , spoke to rech support they are telling the electric motor on the cart is interfering with the radio. Electrical current. They are suggesting i install a capacitor. Has anyone heard if this.? The radio, jensen jms 2212 is for the right application but the mo
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