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Old 04-03-2012, 12:58 PM   #1
bigcsw
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Default 02 PDS Battery Help

I bought an 02 PDS (not lifted, standard tires) a couple of weeks ago and have had it out on the golf course a couple of times and noticed that electric gage on the dash would drop a notch or 2 very quickly and by the time the round was done i was at 50% on the gage. Plus after the first 8 or 9 holes it was laboring going up hills (almost to a stop) but ran fine on flat ground. I also put the cart in dianositic mode and with the pack down to about 75% and under load I was getting the 2-1 low voltage signal.

It was my understanding when I purchased the cart that the batteries are about 1 year old, looking at the date on the posts it looks like they are E/F 0, so not too old. They are all T105's

So after a bunch of reading here I decided it best to take some battery readings and now looking for some input as to next steps.

I checked the voltages on each battery, I'm not sure exactly how long its been since the charger turned off but it's at least 5 hours and I'd guess more like 10 hours or so. Here are my readings ( sorry forgot to do the whole pack)

6.47 - passenger front
6.47 - middle front
6.46 - driver front
6.46 - passenger back
6.29 - middle back
6.46 - Driver back

So I see the middle back battery is low and may be the problem. What interesting to me is off the positive of that battery is a 20amp fused red wire that runs up to the front of the cart. I haven't had a chance to trace it to the end but could it be to the light bar? or the volt gage? Also could whatever it's running to be causing a problem with that battery?

if it's just a battery problem, based on the state of the other 5 could I just replace the one?

Thanks in advance

Charlie
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Old 04-03-2012, 01:38 PM   #2
bigstik40
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Default Re: 02 PDS Battery Help

Judging by your readings, you haven't rested them enough as they are mostly off the chart. Except for the low one, readings look like they may be ok. The fact that you have a red wire through a fuse indicates that two batteries may be supplying 12 volt accessories and your pack is unbalanced. (strange that only one battery comes up low) Try charging only the low battery with a 6 volt charger if possible to see if it will come up to match the rest. If you don't have a 6 volt charger, then charge two with a 12 volt charger making sure you charge the low battery along with another one. Good luck - RAY
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Old 04-03-2012, 04:10 PM   #3
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Default Re: 02 PDS Battery Help

That battery has is part of the 12v system draw. Could be in the past it was treated roughly, you should further test these batteries under load. Surface readings can be deceptive ......
Connect the meter to each individual battery with clips or tape and put the meter on the seat. If you have a hill handy all the better. You will soon know which battery or batteries are giving up the ghost under load.
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Old 04-04-2012, 11:42 AM   #4
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Default Re: 02 PDS Battery Help

Thanks to scottyb for a heads up (wake-up call)!! I always thought that battery resting voltage told the whole story about battery health. After reading scottyb's answer above, I got to thinking about my batteries and that they didn't seem to be lasting that long anymore. I have been monitoring rested voltage and the result always seemed to show that things were ok. I took his advice and took a ride and measured voltage on each battery at "pedal to the metal" speed. Surprise, surprise, one of my batteries dropped to 3.5 volts as soon as the pedal was depressed. So I've found out, thanks to scottyb, that there is more to checking battery health than rested voltage readings. Thanks again. - RAY
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Old 04-05-2012, 08:41 AM   #5
bigcsw
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Default

Thanks for the replies, I had a chance last night to do some tests under load, which was a run about a city block up hill with my me, my wife and my clubs, about 525lbs, yes I'm a big guy :) As a recap I have 2010 T105's with stock wheels. One more observation, my wife took the cart and played a round with her girlfriend the other day and the cart seem to hold up well, and I took it out by myself for a round as well and it did fine. I'm starting to wonder if it's a weight thing and I need to upgrade the wires to 4ga and maybe the controller?

Anyhow here is the battery test runs ( have to drive about a block to get to the hill to start the tests)

Run 1 Full pack - 37.5 at rest. 33.3 under load
Run 2 passenger front - 6.38 rest 5.60 load
Run 3 front middle - 6.41 rest 5.10 load
Run 4 driver front - 6.38 rest 5.70 load
Run 5 driver rear - 6.35 rest 5.73 load
Run 6 middle rear - 6.21 rest 5.50 load
Run 7 passenger rear - 6.38 rest 5.78 load

I did these runs back to back with only enough time between to change the leads. The cart is also running in all-terrain mode.

Thanks again for all the help, Charlie
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Old 04-05-2012, 09:35 AM   #6
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Default Re: 02 PDS Battery Help

I have one meter which has biz alligator clips on the test leads just for this test. This test is invaluable.

Bigcsw, your batteries are dropping pretty hard under load. Give them all a number 1-6. Main + connection on #1 and main- connection on #6. Looks like #2 is hurtin' for certain. In the shop, I would proceed to the spectrum analysis with the refractometer to determine any significant variation between cells... with acute interest in battery #2. You can use a temperature compensating hydrometer. A difference of over 20 pts in cell to cell readings is cause for concern. My guess is that if they were put on a Golf Cart draw down machine the diminished run you mention under 500 pounds load would show them in the 70-80% capacity range. Which is not too good for 2 yr old T105s.

Several aspects factor into DC cart performance. having high resistance is a major factor, as is undersized conductors. Combine the 2 and you will really see a decline in performance.

For best results use big welding cable (not automotive battery cable). And keep all your connections clean.

Battery selection and condition also play a major part in performance. The cheapest battery is often the smallest AH (amp hour rating) Not only will these drain out sooner but the continued deep discharge will eventually over work them and lead to shortened useful life.

The highest AH rated battery you can fit in it is the best battery for your cart. And when the cost is averaged out over it's useful life, it costs less per day than the economy battery. Isn't that the way with a lot of things?
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Old 04-05-2012, 09:43 AM   #7
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Thanks, I'm going to upgrade the cables first this weekend, since the current ones at a bit suspect to me. First off there 6 ga and most if not all of them have exposed wire at the crimp and it looks rusty. I'll also do some more testing on the second battery cells to see what I get.
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Old 04-05-2012, 01:41 PM   #8
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Default Re: 02 PDS Battery Help

also, why not try pulling the smaller accessory wire off temporarilly and this will tell you where it goes. then if you do hook it back up, chose another set of batts. not sure how much this helps, but might.
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Old 04-06-2012, 09:40 AM   #9
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Default Re: 02 PDS Battery Help

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigcsw View Post
Thanks, I'm going to upgrade the cables first this weekend, since the current ones at a bit suspect to me. First off there 6 ga and most if not all of them have exposed wire at the crimp and it looks rusty. I'll also do some more testing on the second battery cells to see what I get.
Other than installing some of ScottyB's silver soldered 2Ga cables (Complete 10 cable set) my 2008 PDS is stock and with my wife and I on-board, it is loaded about the same as yours.
Also, my T-105's are date coded Dec-09, so they're not much older than yours.

When I first got it, I was getting 37.6V (~85% SoC) after a 12Hr rest, with a 0.04V spread between highest and lowest battery.
After a couple months of TLC, I was getting 38.0V (~95% SoC) with a 0.04V spread.
Last time I checked (April 2nd), I was getting 38.1V (~97.5% SoC) after a 28Hr rest and spread is still 0.04V.

All I did was charge, slight or no discharge and then recharge. (Which is essentially a variation of the New Battery break-in procedure with some battery equalization tossed in)
Basically, I put the batteries on charge every night whether I used the cart or not and over the winter months, I initiated a charge cycle about once a week.
I also kept the batteries, cables and connections clean and the batteries properly watered (Distilled water only).

You may not get the same results, but last fall I was planning on replacing my batteries in the spring and now that spring is here, I'm having second thoughts.
(My longest round trip is typically 15 miles and I can do that without crawling up the last hill getting back home, so I'm happy, for the time being )


I put a switch in the short jumper (Between pins 2&3) on a freedom chip and run in either Freedom mode or Mild Hill mode, and get about 18MPH or 14MPH respectively.
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:05 AM   #10
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Default Re: 02 PDS Battery Help

See? I told you all battery usage was everything! LOL
Good job JohnnieB.
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