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Old 09-30-2022, 09:36 AM   #11
mikec557
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volt_Ampere View Post
The real weak link using 12V batteries is that they don't stay balanced. Each one has a BMS but they can't talk to each other to balance. I don't like this configuration. You need to make sure they stay balanced over time.
That makes sense. It's just that there's such a price difference between using 4x12 and the drop in packs, it's hard to not explore that option. With tax and shipping the drop in is just under $3000. And that's only 70Ah. The 100Ah is even more.
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Old 09-30-2022, 10:11 AM   #12
dc.901
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

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Originally Posted by Pat911 View Post
Regen won’t damage lithium batteries. The only problem that may arise is if the battery is near full charge. If enough regen is provided to fully recharge the battery, the BMS will disconnect, leaving your to free wheel down the hill with no brakes, as you’ve experienced before. You really need to be at almost full charge for this to happen and can easily be avoided.
My neighbor changed to Lithium during the summer and he's experiencing this exact issue.

So not charge batteries to 100% is the solution? That is sort of best practice any ways right?

Or is there any other changes that are recommended to avoid "free wheeling"?

Sorry, my questions are probably off topic for this thread?
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Old 09-30-2022, 10:54 AM   #13
Jacob@EcoBattery
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

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Originally Posted by Davey11A View Post
I have been rethinking this battery upgrade to 6 x 8 volt AGM batteries.
After some research the lithium batteries make sense. Slightly more money but appears to be of much better value and longevity.
I would welcome any input from members that have done the lithium conversion. What battery did you use? Any install issues? Any issues after install?
Currently looking at the Eco Battery conversion kit.
Thanks in advance for any input.
Good morning, and great choice wanting to go to lithium. I would love to go over our battery bundles and what best suits your application. Shoot me an email at jacob@ecobattery.com. I look forward to hearing from you.
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Old 09-30-2022, 02:42 PM   #14
Volt_Ampere
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

Look at all of the drop in options. I would go with at least 100AH. There are many more good options these days - there were none when I did it back in 2016. I would stay away from the 12V battery option.
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Old 09-30-2022, 06:45 PM   #15
Davey11A
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

All done rethinking the battery replacement. Eco Battery 105ah conversion kit is on the workbench. I am headed to the garage now to get started on the install.
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Old 09-30-2022, 08:38 PM   #16
Warden902
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec557 View Post
1. What charger did you choose for your setup?
2. Are you using the stock controller or have you upgraded that? (I have an Alltrax)
3. Does the battery BMS ever cut out when you hit the throttle and take a big amp draw out of the batteries? I thought this was the weak link in using the cheaper 12v batteries.

Thanks
I am using the LOLO charger. I have it set to lithium. I contacted Chins and gave them the model number and they said it would work. I think the better option would be to go with the Summit 2 charger. It has a couple of profiles for lithium. I plan on balancing my batteries every couple month's of use. I don't mind to do this for the price difference of the way more expensive drop ins. I am running stock controller with a lift and 20" tires. I have installed a Renogy meter, wich is awesome, and on really steep hills with average weight and full throttle, I have seen over 90amps of draw and have had no issue. I am also running full regenerative braking and have never had the batteries cut out.
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Old 09-30-2022, 09:06 PM   #17
Pat911
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dc.901 View Post
My neighbor changed to Lithium during the summer and he's experiencing this exact issue.

So not charge batteries to 100% is the solution? That is sort of best practice any ways right?

Or is there any other changes that are recommended to avoid "free wheeling"?

Sorry, my questions are probably off topic for this thread?
If the first part of your drive is a long or steep decline, then yes, don’t fully charge. You need to leave some room in the battery to accept the charge supplied by the regen.

If a downward slope isn’t at the start of your trip then sufficient charge will be removed from the battery by the time you get to the decline.

A coulomb counting state of charge meter will help work it how much SOC to leave spare for regen.

The other problem that may be occurring though is that the regen is providing too much charge current and the BMS is tripping out on overcurrent. Your neighbour needs to figure out what is causing the trip to find a solution.

Cheers
Pat.
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Old 10-01-2022, 06:06 PM   #18
Davey11A
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec557 View Post
That makes sense. It's just that there's such a price difference between using 4x12 and the drop in packs, it's hard to not explore that option. With tax and shipping the drop in is just under $3000. And that's only 70Ah. The 100Ah is even more.
mikec557
I purchased the Eco Battery 51v, 105ah complete kit for $2880.00
Just finished the install this afternoon. Couldn't have been easier.
Waiting for the charger to get the pack to 100% and then a test drive.
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Old 10-03-2022, 10:13 AM   #19
Jds1971
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volt_Ampere View Post
The real weak link using 12V batteries is that they don't stay balanced. Each one has a BMS but they can't talk to each other to balance. I don't like this configuration. You need to make sure they stay balanced over time.
So if this is the biggest concern, why can’t one use a 3 bank on board charger such as:
https://www.amazon.com/NOCO-GENPRO10...3b24bcb5&psc=1

Would this not eliminate that weak link?
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Old 10-03-2022, 10:15 AM   #20
Volt_Ampere
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Default Re: Rethinking the 6 x 8 volt upgrade.Lithium?

If you get one designed for Lithium charging - then yes.
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