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Old 10-24-2022, 11:26 AM   #1
Bluesgunner
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Default Cold Weather Charging issues

My Roy Pow 105ah wouldn't charge last week here in Michigan during a cold swing in the weather. I pulled my on board charger and had it checked. It ended up being fine.
I talked to the place that sold me the battery and they said they are still learning a lot about these new lithium batteries. Apparently, the Roy Pow's may not charge at or below 34°.
He said his customers are having more issues with the Eco battery line not charging at or below 43°.
I put my cart in the garage and let it warm up. Problem solved!
This is the first I've heard of cold weather charging with the Lithium's but I still would never go back to the old lead acid.
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Old 10-24-2022, 11:38 AM   #2
jasonojordan
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

Pretty common issue with Lithium. Could always look into a battery warming blanket if need be.
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Old 10-24-2022, 12:15 PM   #3
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

I'm perplexed about this temp "issue". Is this when the air temp is "X"...or when the actual temp of the battery is "X"?
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Old 10-24-2022, 12:53 PM   #4
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

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Originally Posted by DaveTM View Post
I'm perplexed about this temp "issue". Is this when the air temp is "X"...or when the actual temp of the battery is "X"?
Its a bit of both air and battery temp issue, IE left the cart out over night when air and the battery cools to that temp where charging becomes a issue. hence my suggestion if he has to charge outside where its cold a battery blanket to help keep temps up on the cells to allow charging to happen correctly.
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Old 10-24-2022, 03:33 PM   #5
Pat911
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

What you experienced is a sign of good battery design. Lithium batteries ABSOLUTELY should NOT be charged at below 0 Celsius or 32 Fahrenheit.

Obviously the battery manufacturer has placed a temperature sensor inside the battery to prevent this from happening. Where this sensor is placed, along with the actual temperature cutoff setting (may be 35 Fahrenheit for added safety) will vary what the actual ambient temperature cutoff will be.

It is not a RoyPow, or ECO, or (insert X manufacturer here) issue, it’s a Lithium issue. If your lithium battery can be charged at below freezing temperatures it is a bad design and doing so irreversibly and seriously damages the battery cells.

Be grateful your battery has this “issue” as this “issue” just prevented you from damaging your battery.

Cheers
Pat.
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Old 10-24-2022, 04:13 PM   #6
DaveTM
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

I guess from what I'm reading it's the actual battery temp that is the critical matter. I know I have a battery temp probe on my pack and I've never had to charge in sub-freezing conditions as my cart is parked in a heated garage when not "out in use."

But it's good to know that there are solutions to this. (Such as battery blankets and the like)
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Old 10-24-2022, 04:45 PM   #7
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

To be more specific Dave, it’s the internal CELL temperature that is critical.

Cheers
Pat.
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Old 10-25-2022, 07:49 AM   #8
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat911 View Post
What you experienced is a sign of good battery design. Lithium batteries ABSOLUTELY should NOT be charged at below 0 Celsius or 32 Fahrenheit.

Obviously the battery manufacturer has placed a temperature sensor inside the battery to prevent this from happening. Where this sensor is placed, along with the actual temperature cutoff setting (may be 35 Fahrenheit for added safety) will vary what the actual ambient temperature cutoff will be.

It is not a RoyPow, or ECO, or (insert X manufacturer here) issue, it’s a Lithium issue. If your lithium battery can be charged at below freezing temperatures it is a bad design and doing so irreversibly and seriously damages the battery cells.

Be grateful your battery has this “issue” as this “issue” just prevented you from damaging your battery.

Cheers
Pat.
i learn something new every day. I certainly don't want to risk damaging the battery. Thanks
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Old 10-25-2022, 04:40 PM   #9
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

No problems Bluesgunner. Also remember that the internal battery temperature will lag behind the ambient temperature. If the ambient temperature decreases then it will be some time before the battery temperature drops, similarly, when you bring your cart in from the cold, it will take some time for the battery to warm up, hence the varied ambient temperature ranges that your dealer is seeing.

In this case, you can bring your cart in and connect the charger. As expected, it will not charge but as soon as the battery warms enough, the BMS will come out of low temperature protection and the battery will commence charging automatically. This “feature” will still allow you to charge overnight by simply connecting the charger when you get home.

I’m surprised that your dealer didn’t know this as it is widely known limitation of Lithium Batteries.

Cheers
Pat.
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Old 10-26-2022, 07:38 AM   #10
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Default Re: Cold Weather Charging issues

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat911 View Post
No problems Bluesgunner. Also remember that the internal battery temperature will lag behind the ambient temperature. If the ambient temperature decreases then it will be some time before the battery temperature drops, similarly, when you bring your cart in from the cold, it will take some time for the battery to warm up, hence the varied ambient temperature ranges that your dealer is seeing.

In this case, you can bring your cart in and connect the charger. As expected, it will not charge but as soon as the battery warms enough, the BMS will come out of low temperature protection and the battery will commence charging automatically. This “feature” will still allow you to charge overnight by simply connecting the charger when you get home.

I’m surprised that your dealer didn’t know this as it is widely known limitation of Lithium Batteries.

Cheers
Pat.
Hi Pat
The golf cart scene in Michigan is pretty large. They have , over the last decade, exploded with neighborhoods almost being over run. We now are using them all 4 seasons here even to the point of using them as ice fishing rigs.
I don't believe the lithium battery has taken off as much here as elsewhere but I certainly could be wrong. We have an abundance of carts here in Michigan due to the large volume of golf courses. Maybe its because we are flooded with gassers that we are a little behind in regards to lithium use.
For the record, I am the only person in my circle of friends and acquaintances with the lithium conversion.
Thanks for your reply.
Have an awesome day.
Andy
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