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Old 12-01-2011, 12:04 PM   #11
JohnnieB
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutterbug View Post
..................I hope the link will shed some light on charging methods. seems everyone i talk to has their own opinion? Charge them every time you get the cart home, a battery only has so many charge cycles so wait till its at 75% or less? take the charger off when it stops, leave it on the cart? I am sure it is like every thing else, everyone has an opinion? what is right though? I appreciate everyone's advice. thanks!
I stole the chart below from scottyb's website, flipped it so it was in State of Charge rather than amount of discharge and added some voltages to it. IIRC, Scotty got it from Trojan.

I've heard two versions of this, one with 9/18 holes the other with 18/36, but the message is the same for both.
Golf cart batteries have a finite number of discharge/recharge cycles built into them.
When you play 9 holes and recharge, you use 1 cycle.
If you play 18 holes before you recharge, you use 3 cycles.

Basically, the deeper you discharge your batteries before recharging them, the faster you are going to use up the cycles.

Personally, I plug in the charger every night whether I driven the cart 10 yards or ten miles and I don't unplug the charger unless I'm going to use the cart. Or, I need to use the AC receptacle the charger is plugged into.

My advice is to keep your batteries charged to the highest level practical for your usage. In other words, don't not charge because the battery wasn't discharged down to some arbitrary level.
Also, do not put on charge unless there will be enough time for the charger to complete its full charge cycle.
Partial charges are better than no charge at all, but always try to let the charger do its thing without interruption.

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Old 12-01-2011, 01:33 PM   #12
Legendary Golf Carts
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutterbug View Post
thanks guys, I am going to check out the link for breaking in batteries. I did charge them fully the first time. I hope the link will shed some light on charging methods. seems everyone i talk to has their own opinion? Charge them every time you get the cart home, a battery only has so many charge cycles so wait till its at 75% or less? take the charger off when it stops, leave it on the cart? I am sure it is like every thing else, everyone has an opinion? what is right though? I appreciate everyone's advice. thanks!
Red flag, for the first 20 cycles it's 75% or more, after that don't take them below 50%
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Old 12-01-2011, 02:37 PM   #13
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

I'm stealing all of these charts above
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Old 12-01-2011, 02:51 PM   #14
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

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Originally Posted by Legendary Golf Carts View Post
Red flag, for the first 20 cycles it's 75% or more, after that don't take them below 50%
Please correct me with documentation if I am wrong, but I believe your Red Flag contains a Red Flag.

Granted, Lester is a battery charger manufacture rather than a battery manufacturer, but here is what they have to say:

Note: The use of uppercase for emphasis in the first sentence of paragraph #4 is Lester's not mine.


PROPER CARE OF DEEP CYCLE MOTIVE
POWER BATTERIES

Motive power batteries are subjected to severe
deep-cycle duty on a daily basis. Although these
batteries are designed to withstand such duty, the
following precautions must be observed to obtain
good performance and maximum cycle life:

CAUTION: ALWAYS WEAR PROTECTIVE
EYE SHIELDS AND CLOTHING WHEN WORKING
WITH BATTERIES. BATTERIES CONTAIN ACIDS
WHICH CAN CAUSE BODILY HARM. DO NOT
PUT WRENCHES OR OTHER METAL OBJECTS
ACROSS THE BATTERY TERMINAL OR
BATTERY TOP. ARCING OR EXPLOSION OF
THE BATTERY CAN RESULT.

1. When installing new batteries, be sure the
polarity of each battery and overall battery pack
is correct. Due to the electrical characteristics of
this charger, it is possible to hook up the
batteries improperly and not blow the fuse when
charging. Battery and/or charger damage can
result.

2. New batteries should be given a full charge
before their first use because it is difficult to
know how long the batteries have been stored.

3. Limit the use of new batteries for the first 20
cycles.
New batteries and older batteries that
have been in storage are not capable of their
rated output until they have been discharged
and charged a number of times.

4. DO NOT EXCESSIVELY DISCHARGE THE
BATTERIES
. Excessive discharge can cause
polarity reversal of individual cells resulting in
complete failure shortly thereafter. Heavily
discharging (over 60%) new batteries before
they have been broken in (approximately 20
cycles) can cause permanent cell damage,
resulting in reduced energy capacity and
shortened life.


5. Maintain the proper electrolyte level by adding
water when necessary. Distilled or deionized
water is free of contaminants and preferred for
this use. Never allow the electrolyte level to fall
below the top of the battery plates. Electrolyte
levels lower during discharge and rise during
charge. Therefore, to prevent the overflow of
electrolyte when charging, it is mandatory that
water be added to cells AFTER they have been
fully charged; do not overfill. Old batteries
require more frequent additions of water than do
new batteries.

6. Hard crystalline sulfates form when batteries in
storage are not maintained in a charged active
state. Internal self-discharge can bring about
the start of this condition in as little as three days
in warm temperatures. Batteries allowed to sit
unmaintained in storage will self-discharge,
sulfate to various degrees and lose capacity.
Repeated charging without using the batteries
between charges can recover some of the lost
power, range, and life, but some permanent loss
should be expected.

7. When the temperature falls below 65°F, the
batteries should be placed on charge as soon
after use as possible. Cold batteries require
more time to fully recharge.

8. The tops of the batteries and battery hold-downs
must be kept clean and dry at all times to
prevent excessive self-discharge and flow of
current between the battery posts and frame.
Electrolyte spilled on the batteries never dries or
evaporates.

9. All connections to batteries that are bolted must
be maintained clean and tight. Due to heating
and vibration, bolted connections may loosen
over time. Re-tighten the connections twice
yearly to the manufacturer's specified torque.

10. Follow all operating instructions, cautions, and
warnings as specified in this manual, on the
charger, and in your vehicle owner’s manual.


Paragraph # 3 states that battery use should be limited for first 20 Cycles rather than deeply discharged as you suggest. This is also emphasized in paragraph #4 and specifically stated that discharges of 60% and greater during break-in can permanently damage batteries.

For what it is worth, the Battery voltage chart you posted is in State of Charge (which is commonly used around here), while the life expectancy chart is in Percent Discharge (which is less commonly used here).
(That is why I changed the one Scotty has on his website)

Never, ever, take your batteries below 50%.
There can be no confusion on that number since it is the same on both SoC and Percent Discharge scale.
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:10 PM   #15
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

these two conflicting posts are exactly what I mean. I appreciate both of you, and still dont know what the best answer is? Right now I am using the cart minimally and charging it when done. Hopefully I am not hurting the life of my new batteries. I appreciate the time it takes to do the charts, just not sure which is right?
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:29 PM   #16
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

Nutterbug I will pm you with the answer you should take so no conflict is caused here.
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:55 PM   #17
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

thanks colt.
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:57 PM   #18
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

Yes sir. Just figured I would ease your brain a little.
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Old 12-01-2011, 03:57 PM   #19
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutterbug View Post
................I appreciate the time it takes to do the charts, just not sure which is right?
Both theoretical life expectancy charts are correct. The difference is the unit of measurement used in scale on the left
The original, as posted by LGC, is in Depth of Discharge, which is a unit of measurement less commonly used here.
The one I posted is in State of Charge, which is the reciprocal and more commonly used here.

We typically want to know how much energy is left in our batteries rather than how much we have used.
It is like a pint jar with 12 ounces of water in it. Is it a quarter (25%) empty or three quarters (75%) full. (IE: 25% DoD = 75% SoC)

When reading battery care articles, one has to be very aware of what unit of measurement the author is using or implying, else what he/she is trying to convey might come out backwards.
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Old 12-02-2011, 11:36 AM   #20
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Default Re: new brushes and epoxy

thanks guys! I appreciate it. im going to upgrade the controller after christmas and see how that helps. Continue charging it when done.
thanks
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