Motor Upgrade - Are They All a Compromise?

[NoleFan4Ever]

The write up on the website is confusing, it is an upgrade for you, but not to your existing motor. It is a completely new HD motor. Its about 20% bigger and heavier and a WHOLE lot meaner.... I think it runs $590.

[beachguysc]

Originally Posted by NoleFan4Ever

For an IQ cart and an XCT controller, I would definitely go with an Plum Quick Executioner. It will run off and leave the A2 and A4 with any map and since you use an XCT controller, the Executioner II Field Map from Alltrax will allow give you unbelievable torque and speed right out the box.... This is riding torque, not pulling and plowing; for that kind of torque, the A4 is the better choice.

I have an Alltrax xct 400 and looking to upgrade motors. I’m coastal and have no hills at all. I would love to have the speed and torque you speak of, but I also really want to keep Regen braking. Apparently the plum quicks don’t allow Regen. Is there an option that works best with Regen and high speeds( with moderate torque/accel)? It’s confusing reading the specs on some of these motors. They say speeds up to 25mph on the factory and vendor websites for admiral a2’s and fsip. But I already go 26 with my Amd 3.3hp factory motor. I want to top out around 30mph. Is there an affordable motor that can deliver that with my 400 Alltrax, 2awg cables? And still keep Regen?

[NoleFan4Ever]

I am pretty dang sure you would get there with the XCT/PQ combo if you have 22" tires.

I too love the regen and you do still have some left in it, Robby (PQ) explained it to me a while back it is just that he did not leave it fully capable as if running wide open and down a hill and the regen engaged it could rip the armature apart....

I believe he told me you retain about 20%.

[E36Racer]

I bought my PA in January and IIRC it was $635 shipped.


Beachguysc- are you an aggressive regen user? The PQ does not get rid of regen completely, they just say not to turn it up past 65amps. So it’s still there, just not crazy. Try turning yours down to 65amps and you can judge for yourself if it’s enough. Other performances motors do retain regen functions completely.

While on the subject, I’d love to know what is physically/mechanically different in PQ motors to limit regen, and why. And what is mechanically different in a speed motor vs a torque motor.

[dannyre]

Originally Posted by E36Racer

I have the PQ executioner and it is not only faster but does have noticeably more torque than the stock motor. I’d reach out to a site sponsor and get their opinion based on your anticipated usage.

Ditto. I have an PQ Executioner and a 500 amp alltrax and have no problem with speed or torque.

[beachguysc]

Originally Posted by E36Racer

I bought my PA in January and IIRC it was $635 shipped.


Beachguysc- are you an aggressive regen user? The PQ does not get rid of regen completely, they just say not to turn it up past 65amps. So it’s still there, just not crazy. Try turning yours down to 65amps and you can judge for yourself if it’s enough. Other performances motors do retain regen functions completely.

While on the subject, I’d love to know what is physically/mechanically different in PQ motors to limit regen, and why. And what is mechanically different in a speed motor vs a torque motor.

I wouldn’t say aggressive, but I’ve come to rely on it. When going 25-30 with stock brakes, I would like as much stopping power as I can have. And there is that part of me that wants the redundancy in case my stock brakes get a broken cable or just quit one day. Right now, Regen does about 75% of my stopping or slowing down, but removing Regen Might force me to rely more on my 10 year old brakes and cables. I also like the Idea of the power generated going back into the batteries. Although I don’t know how effective that really is in my cart.

[scottyb]

Advertised speeds posted on websites are calculated with stock 18 inch tall tires. Bugger tires change the final gear ratio and increase top speed. Bigger tires also reduce torque. 22-23 inch tall tires (regardless of rim size) increase top speed by about 25%. That's a lot. If a motor is advertised as 27.5 mph at 6000 rpms on 18 inch tires, the same cart and motor with 22-23 inch tires will hit 34.4 mph mathematically assuming good batteries, proper tire inflation, etc.
In my initial test I ran the FSIP A3 unrestrained and it pushed the cart to 32 mph on the flats with stock tires. We then set a very safe 6000 rpm limit on the XCT controller and settled at 27.5 mph. This is plenty fast for me.
Just to be sure we placed the same motor with a different drive shaft in the Ezgo TXT48 and got the same results using the maps Alltrax made for us when we sent them the motor.

As for comparing the FSIP A3 and the Admiral A4 motors goes, they can hit about the same speed when the A4 is mapped for speed. But doing for does reduce some of the monster torque the A4 is capable of. Both motor have full regenerative braking capabilities. The % of which can be preset in the XCT controller or adjusted on the fly with the FN2 dongle.

[E36Racer]

Originally Posted by beachguysc

I wouldn’t say aggressive, but I’ve come to rely on it. When going 25-30 with stock brakes, I would like as much stopping power as I can have. And there is that part of me that wants the redundancy in case my stock brakes get a broken cable or just quit one day. Right now, Regen does about 75% of my stopping or slowing down, but removing Regen Might force me to rely more on my 10 year old brakes and cables. I also like the Idea of the power generated going back into the batteries. Although I don’t know how effective that really is in my cart.

IMO, once you pass the 25mph mark upgraded brakes are a must to save you in a panic stop situation. And I’m no “captain conservative” either, I have a sticker on the back of my cart that says “Safety Second”, actually. But just from a liability standpoint if a kid or animal ever runs out in front of me I figured adding the Ausco kit was the prudent thing to do. In my spouse mode with regen a 65amps and 23mph limit, it is enough to slow the cart without using much brakes on flat ground. My other 2 modes I basically have it turned off now that I added the Jakes front brakes. Once you get to 30 I really think the front brakes are necessary. They cut stopping distance at least in half, maybe more.

Further, I don’t think regen really adds much, if any, noticeable charge driving on flat ground. Plus the ability to coast ultimately reduces battery consumption in my driving conditions. I have not done any formal testing/documented analysis to corroborate either of those statements. But that’s what I think after having driven my cart to the same destination and back home in the various modes and monitoring SOC levels. At the end of the day it’s all preference and YMMV, even if your conditions are the same.

However, if I lived in a hilly area I would definitely want regen so I didn’t have to ride the brakes to maintain a constant speed down hill. And depending on the down hill grade I don’t think 65amps would be enough. But that’s just a guess since I have no real world experience.

[beachguysc]

Originally Posted by E36Racer

IMO, once you pass the 25mph mark upgraded brakes are a must to save you in a panic stop situation. And I’m no “captain conservative” either, I have a sticker on the back of my cart that says “Safety Second”, actually. But just from a liability standpoint if a kid or animal ever runs out in front of me I figured adding the Ausco kit was the prudent thing to do. In my spouse mode with regen a 65amps and 23mph limit, it is enough to slow the cart without using much brakes on flat ground. My other 2 modes I basically have it turned off now that I added the Jakes front brakes. Once you get to 30 I really think the front brakes are necessary. They cut stopping distance at least in half, maybe more.

Further, I don’t think regen really adds much, if any, noticeable charge driving on flat ground. Plus the ability to coast ultimately reduces battery consumption in my driving conditions. I have not done any formal testing/documented analysis to corroborate either of those statements. But that’s what I think after having driven my cart to the same destination and back home in the various modes and monitoring SOC levels. At the end of the day it’s all preference and YMMV, even if your conditions are the same.

However, if I lived in a hilly area I would definitely want regen so I didn’t have to ride the brakes to maintain a constant speed down hill. And depending on the down hill grade I don’t think 65amps would be enough. But that’s just a guess since I have no real world experience.

I looked in to getting the front disc brakes, but quickly learned I can’t really add them to my all sports 3” a arm lift. So now brakes and a new lift would be another 700 to $800 + a dozen or more hours of tinkering, so that won’t happen. I definitely don’t want to go over 30mph but would like to get 28-30 on occasion. I had kinda been set on getting the admiral A2, but have become intrigued by the plum quicks and called them his morning. He recommended the Bandit for my 400 amp Alltrax. He said I could most likely get up to 30mph, But no Regen. I told him I really liked Regen and was considering the the admiral A2 so I could keep it. He understood but said admiral was Chinese junk(something about weak springs) and recommended D&D if I wanted Regen. So I called D&D to ask about theirs. He was straight up and said with my Alltrax pushing my stock AMD 26mph, he couldn’t improve that speed. And I would probably top out 24-25 with his. He said I’m better off just keeping my stock motor and running it into the ground. Which he said might happen sooner than later running an Alltrax. I’ll just say he is not very fond of Alltrax, at all. Something about reduced field on one side. So now I, more confused than ever. Ha. I do plan on going to drive a friends cart that does not have Regen to see if I like it. Not including Regen, What thoughts do you folks have on plum quick bandit vs admiral A2 with an Alltrax 400?

[NoleFan4Ever]

When referring to Admiral he was probably knocking Redhawk.

And I will tell you this, there are tons of controller manufacturer's, but only one with the warranty, support, advances and user controlability and that's an Alltrax.... There is nothing on the market better than an Alltrax at this time....